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Home My WebLink AboutAPRIL 15, 2008 WORKSHOP MINUTES 1 (hT sw C: 'J 4{L R'a y:v MINUTES VIRGINIA BEACH CITY COUNCIL Virginia Beach, Virginia April 15, 2008 Mayor Meyera E. Oberndorf called to order the PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN Briefing in the City Council Conference Room, on Tuesday, April 15, 2008, at 9:00 AM Council Members Present: William R. "Bill" DeSteph, Harry E. Diezel, Robert M. "Bob" Dyer, Barbara H. Henley, Reba McClanan, Meyera E. Oberndorf Ron A. Villanueva, and James L. Wood Council Members Absent: Louis R. Jones arrived at 10:20 A.M. John E. Uhrin arrived at 9:10 A.M. Rosemary Wilson arrived at 10:11A.M. April 15, 2008 2 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 OPERATING BUDGET 9:00 AM The City Manager advised the Workshop will pick-up where City Council left off on April 8`" with Public Works, Stormwater Engineering and Stormwater Maintenance and Operations. 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CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 OPERATING BUDGET AND CIP STORMWATER ENGINEERING/STORMWATER MAINTENANCE AND OPERATIONS VERBATIM CITY COUNCIL Meyera E . Oberndorf, Mayor At-Large Louis R. Jones, Vice-Mayor Bayside - District 4 William R. DeSteph At-Large Harry E . Diezel Kempsville - District 2 Robert M. Dyer Centerville - District 1 Barbara M. Henley Princess Anne - District 7 Reba S . McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E. Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L. Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS 2 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. Spore? CITY MANAGER: Thank you, Mayor . As you said, we ' re about halfway through Public Works . Jason is here to introduce the Stormwater Topic, and then we ' ll follow that with getting into Public Utilities, Water and Sewer, and Facilities . So, we 've got a busy morning . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Before we begin, one moment , I forgot , Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Is the same thing that ' s at our table is also in our binder? PHIL DAVENPORT: Slightly revised. COUNCILMAN WOOD: Take the one out of the binder? Okay. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. I 'm sorry. JASON COSBY: Good morning, Mayor, City Council Members . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Good morning . JASON COSBY: City Manager . We ' re going to introduce two portions of our Budget today, being Stormwater Engineering, and also Stormwater Maintenance and Operations . Before we go into our presentation, I ' d like to introduce several staff members we have here today. We have Mr . John Fowler . He ' s here with our City Engineering staff . We have Mr . Mark Gemender, who is Management Operations Staff Engineer . Also, we have Mr . Bill Johnston also on our Stormwater side of the house . We have Mr . Mike Mundy, also on our Stormwater side of the house, as well . And our two presenters, of course, today are going to be Mr . Phil Roehrs , he ' s going to talk today about the Stormwater Engineering portion, and also lastly is Mr . Mark Johnson, he ' s going to talk about Stormwater Maintenance and Operations . Let me turn it over to Phil . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. PHIL ROEHRS : Good morning, Mayor, Members of Council . 3 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Good morning . PHIL ROEHRS : Appreciate the opportunity to provide a briefing this morning on our Stormwater Resource Management Plan for ' 09 . Let me start with an overview or background, remind you or explain that your Stormwater Management Program really has three major components, and this was the central theme of John ' s presentation, our City Engineer, at the Town Hall Meeting. Basically, it ' s Flood Control, Water Quality, and then Maintenance and Repair . There are some notable idioms there, and that is that there ' s significant overlap between all three of these programs . The one that ' s most obvious is the Flood Control and Water Quality system won ' t work if they ' re not maintained; they won ' t work properly, so that ' s kind of indicative of the overlap . Also notable is to know that these activities are funded both in the Capital Improvement Program and in the Operating Budget . And, furthermore, they' re all funded by our dedicated revenue stream of the Stormwater Utility and the allocation we get from VDOT for Stormwater Maintenance of our roads . As you know, during the last year we 've received some pretty important and significant citizen input on the program. First is the Green Ribbon Committee ' s work, their report to you in November of last year, and then again that Town Hall Meeting we had in February, you got your final report on that in March. Let me go over those just real briefly for you. I 've pulled this table directly out of the Green Ribbon Committee ' s recommendations out of their report . This is found on Page 20 of their report . This is a summary of their recommendations . You ' ll notice the top two assign Public Works as the lead, and that would be their recommendation, to "Develop a Comprehensive Stormwater Management Plan" ; something we 've been looking to do for quite a while . And, secondly, to "Revise City Construction and Maintenance Policies and Processes " , there ' s a sentence at the bottom of the page that I also pulled from their recommendation sheet that kind of explains that second bullet a little bit more . Basically, they ' re suggesting or recommending that we, as the City, take the lead in green practices by going back and addressing some of our existing buildings that did not have Stormwater Quality enhancements built into them. At the Town Hall Meeting, and this is taken from the summary that was provided to you in February, these are the hot topics 4 that seem to spark quite a bit of discussion, several of these are, of course, Public Works related activities, BMP Maintenance, Street Sweeping, we have a significant Public Education Program within Public Works Stormwater, and, of course, the big item is Maintenance of the Stormwater System. We did find in the comments we received from the citizens quite a few, we felt , positive statements . We felt the positives outweighed the negatives by a longshot . But the thing that we heard a lot was many of the citizens present at the meeting were actually surprised at how much the program actually does within such a limited funding stream. With that as background, let me just go over the program highlights . The existing revenue stream, of course, as I mentioned, is the Stormwater Utility Fee and the VDOT allocation. Based on the Fiscal 08 numbers, the program is approximately $21 . 2 million; this is before any adjustment that we ' ll talk to later . Again, these are the three major components, Flood Control , Water Quality, and Maintenance and Repair . Under Flood Control, our significant highlights for the year upcoming would be construction started on the final phase of North Beach Drainage -- not the final phase but the next major phase -- the Lake Holly Watershed, which includes separate projects for both North Lake Holly and South Lake Holly, and then a number of individual neighborhood improvement projects that are listed there . These are slated for work in the Six-Year Program. In Water Quality, we, of course, have a significant monitoring program. We do some retrofits of existing systems, although with this limited funding, basically, we ' re looking at the low-hanging fruit that those projects that are easier to accomplish don ' t involve a lot of real estate and so forth. As I mentioned, we 've got a significant Public Education Outreach, I 'm sure you 've seen the HR Storm commercials we participate in producing and helping to sponsor those efforts . We also have a significant program going on in Lynnhaven, both working with Lynnhaven Now, working with the Corps of Engineers on an overall study of the basin, and we have several projects within the basin to retrofit systems or to look at ways to improve water quality in Lynnhaven. In Maintenance and Repair, there ' s a large gamut, and Mark Johnson is here to speak to that . It involves everything from BMP Maintenance to Pipe, Inlet, Canal Cleaning, and improvements , Street Sweeping, and many more items . 5 That was the highlights of the program. I guess , this is the bad news . These were the major items that we were unable to fund within that funding stream. As significant one, of course, is the Rosemont Forest Drainage Improvements Project; that ' s a rather costly project, and I ' ll go into some detail on that project here in a moment . Many of the Green Ribbon Initiatives we were not able to fund within the program, and significantly our Maintenance and Repair Program is significantly underfunded. Our best estimate is that we were only able to incorporate about 50% of the need for Maintenance and Repair into the proposed budget . So, how are we going to address those gaps? Hopefully, you all have received and have had a chance to look at a March 2008 Policy Report that proposes an increase in the Stormwater Utility Fee . The proposal is to increase the fee 2 cents per year for the next there years . Here ' s how we plan to allocate those funds if approved. You ' ll notice the significant share that goes towards Maintenance and Repair to work down that backlog and to get at some of these neighborhoods that we haven ' t been able to address . We wanted to be able to focus some more attention on Stormwater Quality and get to some of those Green Ribbon Initiatives . And then, under Flood Control, we ' re looking to fund that Rosemont Forest Drainage Project . The way we propose to do that, of course, would be through a bond issue where the additional 2 cents per year for the next three years would work towards paying that debt down . You ' ll notice the spread is weighted heavily towards Maintenance and Repair, but from our perspective what this is allowing us to do is to focus on the Green Ribbon Committee, to address some of the items we heard at the Town Hall Meeting, and to address your priority for Flood Control, which is Rosemont Forest . We have embarked on the design and study of the Rosemont Forest Project . Council funded that design last year with end of year money. We 've received the 35% design documents . Our consultant has come up with a fairly innovative and we think effective way to deal with this problem. The houses that are, the properties that are, boxed on that map are the ones that were significantly impacted during Ernesto . The proposal the consultant has come up with includes both a Pump Station and a Sluice Gate . The problem with Rosemont is the waters downstream back up into this lower lake, and then of course when the water backs up in here, the water can ' t drain out of the neighborhood. What the consultant has proposed is when we reach that condition where the backwater starts and starts to come back into the lake, a Sluice Gate will roll in, seal the lake off from the canals downstream, 6 the pump station will kick on to deliver the water across or through the Sluice Gate down into the canal system with an overall goal, and they think they can achieve it, of protecting flooding within the neighborhood up to and exceeding slightly the 100-Year Storm event . And also, significantly, the 35% design documents confirm our cost estimate of about $6 million. So, at this point we ' re moving forward with the $6 million estimate . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Can I ask a specific question about this project? PHIL ROEHRS : Of course you can, sir . COUNCILMAN WOOD: When they had the flooding from Ernesto, was that 1 foot above the 100-Year Flood Level; what was that in relation to the 100-Year Flood Level? PHIL ROEHRS : Well, you may recall , there ' s a circumstance with this development in that there was some error in design construction where the neighborhood was actually built lower than planned. That event, Ernesto, was off the scale, and I think the Jury is still out on what storm that was, but it exceeded the 100-year Storm. So, you had a combination of the neighborhood being lower than intended and a storm greater than what we would expect to provide protection for . I 'm not sure if I understood your question or addressed it . I can try again. COUNCILMAN WOOD: Maybe I ' ll ask it more simply. Would this protect against what happened in Ernesto? PHIL ROEHRS : Absolutely. Well, Ernesto was a rare event . One foot above the 100-Year Flood Plain is the goal of the project, and the consultant thinks we can get there; that may very well protect the vast majority of the neighborhood. There may still be a property or two that in such a rare storm event might have some flooding . I ' ve heard estimates from Ernesto up to a 500-Year type of occurrence storm, and literally there ' s no practical way to protect everybody from that type of event . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Dyer? COUNCILMAN DYER: Would this also help mitigate some of the problems that they ' re having over 7 in the Glenwood area, also, because we ' re getting some spot floodings over there? PHIL ROEHRS : I 'm sorry, I don ' t believe so, unless and except , and I have Bill and Mike here, unless there was some cross-connection between the neighborhood, the outlying of the service areas shown there on the map, what we ' re intending to do with this proposal is to isolate that area to seal it off from other drainage basins, and to be able to protect the core of this neighborhood. I don ' t believe it would spill over into other neighborhoods, unless there was a linkage that we might be able to help there . COUNCILMAN DYER: Okay. Thank you. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I don ' t want to be suspicious, and I guess my questions are we ' re spending a lot of money, and I want this neighborhood to be improved, but if it ' s so low to start with, these neighborhoods where we 've tried to make improvements where they were built too low, and there are too many of them in this city -- you know, the other day, the last storm we had, the man that took all the pictures in my neighborhood and turned in to you all are all of where projects have been done, and you all gave answers concerning each of them. A lot of money has been spent along Rosemont Road in all of that general area for flooding; it was where the pipes were not put in properly to start with and the drainage. I guess, I 've come to the point that it ' s one thing to spend the money and spend whatever it takes to bring them up to a better level of expectation. And you all are totally convinced spending this money for how many homes is it? PHIL ROEHRS : Within the service area, there ' s well over a hundred. The severely impacted properties number in the twenties . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: And that we ' re not going to be faced with projects where we 've spent this kind of money and we ' re still having the same kinds of problems? PHIL ROEHRS : Well, there can always be a storm that exceeds the design event . When you select a pipe diameter and a system and you size it for, in this case, the 100-Year Storm, if the 110-Year Storm 8 arrives and the antecedent or the preceding conditions are such that the ground is already saturated and all these things can add up to create a circumstance that was not anticipated by the design. And it ' s really a matter of economics, when you try to reach that, as I responded to Councilmember Wood, you can ' t protect against a 500-Year Storm; it ' s just not economically feasible . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: But would it not be, we ' ve discussed this before, but some of those houses that are the lowest, would it not be more economical to just buy them? PHIL ROEHRS: You know, that ' s a matter that we 've considered. Of course, we ' re a little timid to talk about that . We might need some direction or guidance from Council to publicly speak about it . You know, $6 million is what we ' re proposing here for construction, alone, and one might take that view and say "well , gee, if there are 20-some odd properties that are impacted, couldn ' t we just buy them instead" ? That ' s, some would say, the heavy hand of government . I 'm not sure we ' re at liberty to make that recommendation. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Well, if I may continue this, Madam Mayor? I 'm not going to ask you to do it right now, but how much in this informing us about what the new Flood Control, the Federal Government, the things they' re saying and doing, because I 'm finding that insurance, even though people have it, is not covering a lot of these things that are occurring, and I guess at some point in time I want you all to show me that, because I can think of some houses in my neighborhood that the water ran through and we eventually are in better shape and the water is no longer running through them, but we ' d have been a lot better off, I think, somewhere, I can think one or two, particularly, that it happened over and over, so you all are going to tie together for us with assurances that if these people have flood insurance and have paid for flood insurance that they ' re entitled to remuneration and upgrade of the property and how we fit into the whole thing; are we going to hear that, I mean, somewhere in this? PHIL ROEHRS : I think I 'm understanding you, and I think we ' ll be able to address that in our presentation on Rosemont when we get to that point . We ' ll try to provide you some feel for the value of the properties being protected, and we ' ll bring in the flood insurance component, what type of coverage do they have . 9 MAYOR OBERNDORF: We have two other Council Members . Mrs . Henley, followed by Mr . Dyer? PHIL ROEHRS : Absolutely. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, the important thing that I think we maybe sometimes lose sight of is how interconnected everything is, and it goes back, I think, to the front end, and that is the development of a parcel . And the fact of the mater is, given our topography, there are just some places that probably shouldn ' t be developed or shouldn ' t have been developed. And I think we try to think that we don ' t have limiting factors , that we can overcome anything with engineering or whatnot, and therefore we tend to think that we can do the same on every property in the city. When we have the decision to make, when we ' re going to approve or not approve a particular development, one of the things that I think is really critical as we look at all of the factors is, and it comes up and particularly I think now that we ' re seeing some of the properties that were passed over with the first round development because they were difficult development or difficult to develop or maybe shouldn' t be developed, we ' re getting more and more of that, but we never have in any of our preliminary work a discussion, for example, of how difficult is it going to be to keep this neighborhood from flooding and what ' s it going to cost . And I , really, I think we really need that, because we wind up having to correct things . Maybe looking at a design plan, we might think "well, the developer can design this to take care of the flooding" , but in reality, if it doesn ' t work, then it comes back on the City to do this kind of retrofit . And I just think that we 've got to have this information at the front end instead of at the back end with these properties that have these problems . If there ' s a creek or something that ' s going to be impacted and it ' s not going to drain well or something, we really need to have this so that we don ' t get into this situation, because, now, once this family is there, these families are there, we have the responsibility to do our best to keep it from flooding . And also, folks have to understand when they buy in an area that is a lot of flood plain, there are going to be times that water is not going to go off their yards in two hours; it ' s going to stand. I guess , our main thing is to keep it out of the dwellings, keep it out of the buildings, but we just 10 almost don ' t have the capability. And we can certainly look at all the floods that are happening in the midwest and so forth, especially, when you build in low-lying areas you can ' t expect that the water is going to go away in a blink of an eye when we get these big rains . So, it ' s all interconnected and we can ' t separate it, but very clearly we have allowed development in places that probably shouldn ' t have been developed to begin with or it didn ' t work, whatever was put in. Then we do find ourselves in this responsibility and it ' s frustrating, but I think it ' s what we ' ve got to realize will happen if we want to develop and continue to develop; it ' s a choice we have to make . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. Dyer? COUNCILMAN DYER: Thank you very much. Along the lines of Mrs . Henley ' s and Mrs . McClanan ' s comments , we did broach the residents of that area about the possibility of a buyout as one of the considerations, and they respectfully declined and adjacent neighbors were concerned about the swiss cheese effect of the neighborhood and a few other things . But these people really feel that they ' re their homes, and that ' s where they want to stay. This development is over 30 years old, and it was built years ago before disclosure and a few other things that were there, and it was built about a foot and a half below flood plain, I believe . PHIL ROEHRS : I think it was 1 foot . COUNCILMAN DYER: About 1 foot . And, Mayor, you were out there, as well as some other Council folks , Harry came out, Bill came out, these folks literally had a foot of water in their homes , up to the toilet bowl lids . And they went through with tremendous amount of difficulty with the insurance companies, in terms of getting payment and everything, and a lot of them were displaced for over six months . And, once again, I would just hope that Council does, once again, this was a situation that nobody, staff or Council, was responsible for, but, once again, these are folks that I think deserve consideration. MAYOR OBERNDORF: I can ' t argue with you, having seen what they' ve gone through. And I do know that the families have called and said that they bought there years ago, and they want to remain in that neighborhood. But it ' s part of the conversation that needs to be articulated around this table with the input of the people that are directly affected. 11 I wonder in the future for those troublesome pieces or parcels that people come in and ask for rezonings and higher densities and things, is the staff able to evaluate based on the proposal made by the development community how the potential is for flooding and things of that nature? In the packet, like we talk about traffic, we talk about other things, but I 've never seen an official assessment by you all , the engineers, who have to deal with the aftermath and those of us on Council . PHIL ROEHRS : It does occur, Madam Mayor. As you know, we have a Flood Plain Ordinance in our Site Plan Section of the City Code . Every development is reviewed under that Ordinance . We also have the benefit of assistance by FEMA, who ' s done a flood insurance rate study for our whole city and helped us established what the predicted flood elevations are . And while you may not see it in the package, all development comes through the process and have to be compliant with the Flood Zone Ordinance, which requires that homes be built at least 1 foot above the 100-Year predicted flood elevation. It also requires that the developer install an adequate system to convey water, retain water, and actually treat it for water quality. And all those things are reviewed by staff, and if there ' s an exception, if the developer can ' t meet those requirements, that ' s when you do see it , when you ' ll see a request for a waiver for that portion of the Zoning Ordinance . So, without that request for an exemption, you should assume and trust that it ' s been reviewed, and to the best of our ability we 've determined that it ' s compliant with the Flood Zone Ordinance, and the property should not flood up to and slightly exceeding the 100-Year Storm. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: But sometimes even with your best review the system doesn' t work, and this one is 30 years old. And you say, "well everybody who approved this one is not in the system anymore" , but, I mean, Castleton is not that old, but I know they had tremendous problems and I hope it ' s fixed somewhat, but then we 've got those others in that area that have also continually had problems with flooding . And, I don ' t know, I mean, I know you can look at the design and run the numbers and so forth, but until it ' s in place and then we find out it has problems, we ' ve got the "oh" effect, and the "uh-oh" effect comes to us to rectify. 12 But I 'm thinking of one that ' s just under construction now or the site work being done, it hasn ' t had any houses built, but the adjoining neighborhood suddenly starts having some problems when you take out the trees and everything that ' s been controlling the water somewhat, then you hit something that ' s surrounding it . And, I don ' t know, but as I said, when we do these it ' s something that I think we don ' t give enough consideration to. I know we could talk about this all day. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Mrs . Henley is absolutely correct, because that Pine Ridge development, we had a Homarama out there, and then we had the pictures from the TV and the news floating around in the water . I know when I went out there to drive around, the water was deep, and it ' s in the same, it all runs , Hunt Club, all those neighborhoods ; it ' s all been a problem. And I think as each part has been built, the problem has shifted to the next, simply dumped off on the next neighborhood. PHIL ROEHRS : Well, we certainly evaluate downstream impacts . That ' s part of the review, and we require the developers ' consultants to show us the downstream impacts, and then we review his work and to the best of our ability try to . But Mrs . Henley really hit on it, and John Fowler, our City Engineer, repeated this during a Town Hall Meeting, we have some significant challenges here in Virginia Beach with drainage . We ' re an extremely flat community. Some of our flow paths from this neighborhood, in particular, to get out to the ocean are remarkably long, surreptitious routes through the city before you get to the ultimate outfall, and that can present backwater problems . So, the topography is the real major challenge, but I think she tapped on the other issue, and that is what Mark is going to speak to in a moment, is 0 & M. If we are unable to properly maintain the system, keep the leaves and accumulated sediments out of the pipes, they don ' t function as designed, so that ' s a very key component . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: But who ' s -- there ' s nobody to go back on when it doesn ' t work. The point that she ' s made is exactly correct . But those same engineers that said "oh, sure, it can work within the limits of this property, it ' s going to work fine, there ' s no problem" , and then we pay the bill . PHIL ROEHRS : I understand your point, ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: And I 'm tired of paying the bill . 13 PHIL ROEHRS : We ' re reactive to development . We don ' t propone development . We review their plans . You 've already approved them. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I 'm not going to ( inaudible) on that . That argument has been going on ever since I 've been here . It was before I got here, and it will be here long after I 'm gone, you know. As long as there ' s an inch of land in this city, somebody will be arguing whether it ' s suitable . PHIL ROEHRS : We ' re also somewhat limited in what we can force on a developer . We have a City Code that we can enforce . We ' ve got State Codes and general engineering theories, but we can ' t arbitrarily say "do something much greater" ; so, we have some limitations . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes, Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Well , you say that and I kind of wonder, nowadays you have to have FEMA Flood Elevation Certification on a lot of these properties . Was that not the case back 30 years ago when this was built? PHIL ROEHRS : That was just becoming the case when this neighborhood was under construction. I think it was 1976 that we entered the National Flood Insurance Program, and at that point we were fledgling, we had our first rate insurance study, our insurance rate study, but we didn ' t have the city very well mapped out at that point in time . We had gotten a lot better . In fact, I hope y ' all are aware that we ' re under a map modernization right now, and we have some brand new maps ready to present to the public and receive their input on, some highly accurate maps now, so we 've progressively gotten better at it . In today' s world, I think we can avoid some of these problems . COUNCILMAN WOOD: But back then you didn ' t have to have an elevation certificate or anything like that? PHIL ROEHRS : You probably did. I was in high school at the time, so I 'm not sure exactly what was going on here at the City. But the rules have advanced and become more thorough and complete, and I know that ' s certainly the case now, but back then I 'm not sure . 14 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, I think you sense the concern that some of us have articulated. In the past, when the land was still in farming, you always knew that the farmer built their home on the highest portion of the property so that -- COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Farmers aren ' t dumb. MAYOR OBERNDORF: No, I was giving farmers a compliment . But for the rest of us who moved in and had never lived on the land, it became apparent in the first heavy rain storm what was sufficient and what wasn ' t . So, I think that ' s the frustration that ' s being articulated here . Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I have actually two quick questions, and one I hate to continually bring up is the street sweepers . I still don ' t understand the methodology for the scheduling of street sweepers for the neighborhoods that directly surround the Lynnhaven and dump directly into the Lynnhaven where a majority of them we just don ' t do . And I thought that Stormwater Management , Clean Water, and the Water Quality, I thought some of that money was actually used to purchase one or two of the street sweepers, if I 'm not mistaken, from our last conversation or two on it, Mrs . McClanan brought that up . PHIL ROEHRS : Mr. DeSteph, could I defer that question for Mark Johnson, who ' s coming up next in just a few moments? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay, great . And then, let ' s go back one slide? PHIL ROEHRS : Sure . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: On this one here, this excludes the CIP, correct? PHIL ROEHRS : No, this is both CIP and Operating Funding. I think the majority is within the Capital Improvement Program, but I think some of it also will be within the Operating Budget . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, just for my clarification and edification, the Stormwater Management Fund, which is what we collect, this is all we 15 collect in a year on it? PHIL ROEHRS : No . I 'm sorry, you ' d have to go back a few more slides . Right now, $15 . 6 million before any rate adjustments . Last year ' s numbers were $15 . 6 million, and we also get about $5 . 5-$5 . 6 million from VDOT. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I saw that, but then I would expect to see our project expenditures here to be right around $20 million. PHIL ROEHRS : They are, sir . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Well, $700 , 000 and $430, 000? PHIL ROEHRS : This is just the increase, the 2 cents per year for the next three years . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. PHIL ROEHRS : This is just the amount of the increase, and, again, you can see we ' re weighting it heavily towards Maintenance and Repair. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, somewhere else we ' re going to have where that money is being spent? PHIL ROEHRS : Yes . You ' ll see that on Slide 5 , I think. The $21 . 2 million, there ' s a pie chart there that demonstrates that about $4 . 7 million is dedicated currently to Flood Control and all of those Capital Improvement Projects, $1 . 7 for Water Quality Initiatives and Projects, and about $14 . 8 million in Maintenance and Repair . Mark is going to speak to Maintenance and Repair in just a moment . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. Got it . I ' ll hold my questions for Mark. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you, both. Are you ready to make the -- PHIL ROEHRS : One more slide for me, if you will? Finally, the other component that we want to address with this additional money would be to approach some of these Green Ribbon Committee recommendations . And first, in lieu of a comprehensive Stormwater Management Plan, which is our goal, 16 what we think would be a more reasonable approach would be to systematically go at it watershed by watershed. Maybe at the end we can tie it all together as a blueprint for the entire city. But basically, what we would propose to do is to go into one watershed initially and do investigations and studies, find out what would be the most appropriate improvement, then in the second year in that watershed we ' ll approach design while we begin studying another watershed. Then in the next year, we ' ll actually do some construction, some retrofitting, in that third year in that initial watershed, and so we ' ll sequence through them; that ' s what we would propose . As far as retrofitting Municipal facilities , there are several major facilities that are City-owned that do not have appropriate or fully adequate water quality features built into them. So, we propose to approach some of the Recreation Centers for improvements , some Schools, perhaps, the large facility over at Social Services , and then maybe even right here in this Municipal Complex where there are some things that we think we could make some significant changes . So, that brings you through the Flood Control and Water Quality aspects and how we would propose to use the additional funding that ' s being recommended. And with that, I ' ll turn it over to Mark Johnson, who is our Infrastructure and Maintenance Administrator, to speak to the Maintenance aspects . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Good morning, Mr . Johnson. MARK JOHNSON: Good morning . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Before you get started, I apologize . I 've just found a note here from Mrs . Wilson, who says that she is attending a Workshop at the Development Authority Meeting and that she will be coming as soon as that is completed. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I believe the Vice Mayor is there, also . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. So, she and the Vice Mayor are at the Development Authority. They will be here as soon as that meeting is over . Thank you. MARK JOHNSON: Thank you. Well , let me give you this morning ' s description of humor at work. And that is, on the screen we ' re showing last week ' s 17 presentation, and what we just handed out was this week' s presentation. So, I 'm going to talk to the slides and talk about the differences between what ' s on the screen and what ' s in your handout we handed out today, and then I 'm going to talk to the handout we handed out today. If you look at your presentation we handed out today, the Maintenance and Repair number is 10 . 3 . You see on the slide it ' s 14 . 8 . What we did over the past week, we tried to balance the Stormwater Fund on the three main activities , which is Flood Control, Water Quality, and Maintenance and Repair . So, we tried to do a little bit better job there. But what we really are trying to show is right now a significant slug of the Stormwater Fund goes to Maintenance and Repair, and that ' s a pretty good strategy. If you go to the next slide, I think a question came up about CIP dollars and Operating Budget dollars, the fund provides funding for both. The slide you see in the presentation has a large red chunk called CIP Maintenance . There are about four projects in the CIP that provide the Maintenance side of Public Works funding to do maintenance to the system. If you look at the slide in the handout, what we did is we balanced the red chunk among the major activities, which are Street Sweeping, Pipe Cleaning, Off-Road Ditch Cleaning, Road Side Ditch Cleaning, Cave-in Repair and Rehab, Pipe Rehab. All I did was I just blended that to get away from does money go to the CIP or does money go to the Operating Budget, but I put it on the activities that we actually do . We do two primary things, we clean the system and then we repair the system. Clean the system, basically, is Street Sweeping, Pipe Cleaning, Off-Road Ditch Cleaning, Road Side Ditch Cleaning. Now, the current Street Sweeping program, we sweep arterials every sixty to ninety days . During the season, we sweep the Oceanfront every night, seven nights a week. We sweep Town Center one night a week right now. And then we have the Residential Street Sweeping Program for the Lynnhaven Watershed, which we basically sweep streets that have curb and gutter and are not served by a Stormwater Management Facility or a pond. If they ' re already served by a pond, we do not sweep those streets, and we ' re on an 18-month cycle . I will tell you that we are looking at what it would cost to expand what I ' ll call the Lynnhaven Watershed Street Sweeping Program to other watersheds in the city. And it can range from doing it annually, having an annual cycle, which will cost you first year about $500, 000 , $500 , 000 and two workers , or if you decided to go monthly, it will cost you about $7 18 million first-year cost . You ' d have to hire 29 Street Sweeper Drivers, and you ' re off and running throughout the city, but it ' s going to cost you $7 million first year . And what we ' re looking at is providing that information towards the end of the month. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Can you give me a better definition between Residential Street Sweeping and 0 and M Street Sweeping, please? MARK JOHNSON: Yes . Residential Street Sweeping is Lynnhaven Watershed. That was what was created to focus on the Lynnhaven two to three years ago . It hired one street sweeper, bought a street sweeper, and that ' s where they just focused on, the Lynnhaven Watershed, sweeping streets with curb and gutter that are not served by a Stormwater Management Facility. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, we have one street sweeper doing residential . MARK JOHNSON: Right . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: And we have, what, a dozen doing 0 and M street sweeping? MARK JOHNSON: We have four, four doing 0 and M; that ' s the City ' s arterial roadways, every sixty to ninety days, that ' s the Resort Area during the season seven nights a week, and that is Town Center one night a week. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I guess, then, the disparity between cost, you ' ve got one that ' s $62 , 500 and then four that are $883 , 000, more in these numbers , I guess, then, just labor? MARK JOHNSON: Yes , yes . What I tried to do, these do not necessarily reflect cost . They reflect the funding that would go to those activities . So, I have spread indirect costs that the fund supports, such as sending out bills , paying financial debt, other things that are not directly related to the activity, but the fund has to absorb, so I tried to spread it among all the activities . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: It ' s related to this , but am I to understand that you ' re hiring the employees because over the last several years since the 19 Stormwater thing came in, I get different answers every time I ask questions about how many employees are covered under the regular department costs and then how many are covered under the tax that ' s paid, you know, that some employees are, and if I understood what you just said, the operators for the street sweepers would be paid for out of the Stormwater Tax? MARK JOHNSON: Yes, ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: As well as the equipment? MARK JOHNSON: Yes , ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Then how many other employees in these other categories are paid for out of the tax, itself, versus -- because I think it ' s a little bit, when you lump employees and their payment and costs with consultants and with the projects , themselves , that we don ' t have the breakdowns in here on those projects , how many other employees are paid for under these particular categories? MARK JOHNSON: We can provide you that information. But from Operation and Maintenance, we have 68 employees that are paid to do overall Stormwater Maintenance, and Inspections and Storm Response on this slide, there are four employees , and in Residential Street Sweeping there is one employee, in Engineering there ' s seven, I believe, in Engineering that are funded by the Stormwater Utility. I think there are two employees funded for Customer Service, and I 'm probably missing two other employees . I missed one more, so we can get you that number . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Sure . That would be helpful . Thank you . MARK JOHNSON: The pie chart in your handout, again, what I 'm really trying to focus on is we clean the system, we repair the system. Now, if you go to the next slide, I want to focus on repairing the system. Here you have three exciting pictures of the inside of storm drain pipes in Princess Anne Plaza . The upper right is an open pipe joint , which has, it appears, ground water and sediment leaking in in the joint . Your bottom picture, you have an offset joint of a pipe system where it looks like the contractor stuffed clay bricks underneath of it to stop up the hole and then cover up the pipe . And then, upper left , you ' ll see the inside of a pipe wall where it ' s starting to show its age where it ' s cracking. So, those are the types of things 20 we ' re dealing with, and that ' s what ' s happening underground. Basically, they ' re about 25 joints for every 100 feet of storm drain pipe in the city, so we have quite a few. The next slide, some fun facts, the real thing I ' d like you to get here is the failure is at the pipe joints . The symptom we see is the cave-in. The road caves in, the yard caves in, there ' s a hole somewhere which we have to respond to and then we have to investigate the pipe joint failure . So, we end up repairing the pipe joint, and we end up filling the hole in. The overall condition of the system is a Grade-D, which we classify as fair . However, basically, 60% of the pipe system is from a Grade-D to a Grade-F . You have 40% above Grade-D to Grade-A, so we are right at the time frame in the life of the City ' s pipe system where we really need to start focusing on doing some sort of rehab work to get these pipe systems back up to a Grade-C and get our level of service up. Next slide, what we did here, this is a map that shows, and we look at the symptoms, and the symptom is cave-in, we look at neighborhoods to see which neighborhoods were having the most cave-ins . The dark brown, those are the neighborhoods who are the winners . We have two that they've experienced 90-120, 117 , cave-ins . Basically, that ' s Princess Anne Plaza and Green Run. The lighter brown, we ' ve had two neighborhoods on this map, and then the next lightest brown we have nine, that ' s 31-60 cave-ins . What we want to do here is get a feel for the trend and really try and hone in on where these cave-ins are taking place . Just to let you know, last year we repaired just over 2 , 000 cave-ins throughout the city, so it is some work and there are some trends out there . Next slide, I 've got a list here of 18 neighborhoods, and they ' re the 18 top neighborhoods, and this is the relative priority. I put a little extra information in the presentation we handed out today. I listed age of the neighborhood and population, and the age is when we first, the first year we started maintaining infrastructure in that neighborhood, and that ' s the starting age . The population numbers, they ' re roughly right . I pulled them from various databases . There are, in other words, more correct population numbers out there, but what I wanted to illustrate was that if we repaired the systems in these 18 neighborhoods , basically you ' re improving the drainage for about 36% of the population of Virginia Beach. So, with my numbers , I would say 30-40% of the population would benefit from these improvements . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Just what we have versus what you 21 have there, you 've got Aragona 1980 . So, was there major work done between when Aragona was built well before 1980 and when the City took it over, because Aragona was built well before 1980? MARK JOHNSON: Yes, and I 'm not too sure what that time gap is, but I noticed that, also . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Twenty-five years or so . MARK JOHNSON: I 've got to check that, but our pavement records indicate we first started maintaining roadways in 1980 , so that ' s something they've got to work on. What that means is the pipe system is twenty-five years older than 1980, which tells me we probably have a bigger problem in Aragona than what we realize right now. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mark, looking at these housing areas , I know the one that I ' ve lived in since I moved here, Carolanne Farm, was built in the 60 ' s , and is that system still sound? MARK JOHNSON: Relatively, yes, you are a light yellow, which means you ' re probably a Service Level C, still . So, overall, your system should be pretty good with respect to cave-ins and pipe joint failures . It ' s not to say that your system is not designed to a 10-Year Storm event, which it is not, and that ' s why you see street flooding when you get fairly intense rain storm events, especially summertime thunderstorms which only last fifteen minutes, but they ' ll flood your streets . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. I appreciate that, because when I looked over at Fairfield ' s name there I knew we were older than their buildings there; that ' s why I asked. MARK JOHNSON: If you look at this list, earlier in another slide I said 60% of the storm drain system was built or serves pre-70 neighborhoods . However, you look at this slide, it will show neighborhoods that were built after 1970 . So, you kind of go "okay, what ' s the issue there" ? There ' s probably other issues other than design, pipe size design; it ' s soils, it ' s elevation, it ' s ground water table, it ' s maybe material, installation possibly. There ' s other issues that are causing those neighborhoods to have pipe joint failures and cave-ins . 22 MAYOR OBERNDORF: I appreciate that . Mr . Dyer, then Mrs . Henley? COUNCILMAN DYER: Just a question. It seems the Centerville District is indeed blessed by making this list a couple of times . Glenwood is, I think, a relatively new development overall . So is Salem Woods . How come they' re in such a state of disrepair? MARK JOHNSON: I think it ' s a combination of things . I think it ' s high ground water table . It ' s installing pipe systems in poor soil conditions . So, I think you 've had pipe settlement, and probably because you had high ground water table and poor soil conditions, the contractors probably had a tough time getting the pipe joints where they needed to be . So, I think it ' s a combination of things that are happening with those younger neighborhoods that are popping up on the list . COUNCILMAN DYER: Because it seems like you have a pretty good chunk there, just looking northeast to Stumpy Lake, that there ' s a whole good sized area there . MARK JOHNSON: I think if we look at the soil maps and put all that together, it will start to tell us why we ' re experiencing those failures . But what it also tells you is it makes sense to go into these neighborhoods where the pipe, itself, is still relatively new and do rehabilitation efforts, such as slip lining to seal those pipe joints up to reduce the cave-ins and extend the overall life of the system, which still has nice, non-cracked, healthy concrete pipe systems . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I was real surprised to see Courthouse Estates on here . But just so I 'm clear in my mind, basing on this experience with the cave-in repairs , and that ' s those that are colored from 31-60, the light orange, you ' ve pulled those 18 neighborhoods, and based on the cave-in repairs history in these 18 neighborhoods they are the ones that we are looking at in doing this neighborhood repair program over the next eight years with this 2 cent increase . So, that ' s the determination and that ' s how you came up with this list ; these are those -- MARK JOHNSON: Yes . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: -- that are showing cave-in repairs , 23 which means the joints are bad and so forth, and so these are the neighborhoods that will get the attention? MARK JOHNSON: Yes, ma ' am. That ' s what we ' re proposing, attack these 18 neighborhoods first . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: And as you clearly said, I mean, it ' s not based on the age of the neighborhood; it ' s going back to, again, other factors, as well as age and so forth, because when we look at some of these new neighborhoods like Courthouse Estates and Southgate and so forth that we don ' t really think of as being old neighborhoods, it ' s kind of telling. MARK JOHNSON: Yes . Well , when you look at street flooding, the first thing you want to look at it pre-70 neighborhoods, post-70 neighborhoods, because that ' s where your design change took place from a 2-year to a 10 . From a maintenance perspective, looking at the pipe system with respect to cleaning and repair, you look at symptoms like cave-ins to get a feel for the quality of the system that ' s serving the neighborhoods . You could have a pipe system that is designed to handle a 10-year storm, however, due to the pipe joints and the siltation within the pipe, it is now functioning at a 5-year storm event or maybe back down to a 2 . So, the goal is do this rehab work and restore the pipe system to its original design capacity and hopefully maybe even exceed it a little bit . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Diezel? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: When I say the word "rehab" , I get a little nervous . I understand the sliplining and the function there, but in terms of rehabbing are you anticipating having to dig up significant mileage of pipe? MARK JOHNSON: That ' s not the goal or the plan of attack we want to go after . What we will probably end up doing is specific location dig ups where we have really bad joints, fix those, but the overall general plan is to slipline the pipe or the pipe systems . Basically, it ' s the process has three main things . The first thing is you go in and you clean the system. The second thing is you inspect it and come up with relatively straightforward design solutions for the specific areas in the overall pipe system, and then the third thing is you slipline the pipe . That ' s the program we want to get into to attack these and basically 24 we ' re envisioning a 12-month process to get those three main things accomplished in a neighborhood. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Is there a limiting factor, in terms of length of sliplining? MARK JOHNSON: You ' ll run your slipline from basically manhole to manhole, which is approximately 300 feet . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Okay. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Any other Members of Council wish to ask a question or make an observation? Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Is this the, I see we ' re at the end of the slides , were you finished? I just wanted on Stormwater to make some comments about the Green Ribbon Committee? MARK JOHNSON: We ' ve got one more . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Go ahead. MARK JOHNSON: This is my part of the summary. Basically, right now, today ' s dollars, we estimate the 15 neighborhoods -- I mean, the 18 neighborhoods to be about $15 million. If we get the 2 cent increase, we ' re projecting that we can accomplish this work within eight years . And basically, it ' s going to move a good portion of the overall neighborhoods from Grade-D to Grade-C . So, hopefully after eight years we will be at maybe 50 , maybe 60% , C and above, 40-50-% C and below, and that ' s where we want to go . And we envision this program to just be continuous , but that ' s the overall strategy for Maintenance and Repair . And I think it ' s a good blend, if you blend Maintenance and Repair, you blend the work in to implement Stormwater Management systems on City properties that do not have them, and then you look to finance some money to continue Rosemont Forest . With that, any questions? MAYOR OBERNDORF: I believe, one other Member of Council indicated that they wanted to ask a question. Jim, was it you? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Mrs . Henley. 25 COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I just wanted to make some more comments about Stormwater, in general, if it ' s more to the presentation or not . Well, I can just go ahead and say what I 'm going to say. The Green Ribbon Committee throughout this Stormwater Management Plan presentation this morning, we ' ve heard mentions of recommendations of the Green Ribbon Committee, and I ' d just like to make some comments . I was fortunate enough to be the liaison and to have an opportunity to work with that . If y' all remember, this was actually a, I think, proposal from Peter Schmidt just at the time that he went off the Council . And so, this committee was formed or named in the summer of 2006 and had its first meeting, I believe, in November of 2006 . I think there were about 30 people on the committee . It was a very diverse group of people with a lot of staff folks from Public Works and Planning and others, citizens from the environmental groups concerned with water quality, and a lot of folks from the development community, which made a really interesting mix. And the amazing thing was that the committee worked so well together, and I think everybody found that they had similar goals, and of course that ' s improving the water quality. And I know that just remembering over the years any time we have these little focus groups and ask people what are the things that they really like about Virginia Beach, our waterways are always at the top of the list , and folks being concerned about our waterways and keeping the water quality as good as we possibly can, restoring it that way. The main committee then split into three subcommittees, and each subcommittee had its areas to particularly explore. And these subcommittees just met intensely over the next several months, and each subcommittee came up with this list of recommendations, and it was a very open process . The meetings were all advertised. Anyone who wanted to sit in could. The minutes of each of the subcommittees were always on the web. The Green Ribbon Committee was on the Home Page, so everybody could follow it . I know the subcommittee that I was on, and then as we kind of brought these together there was a lot of talk about incentives, what we could do to offer incentives for water quality improvement . And there was talk about "well , you know, some of these things you ' re recommending are going to cost money, and are we going to be willing to raise the fees" ; 26 so, it was something that those committee members were constantly aware of and concerned about . Then about this time last year, the three subcommittee reports were put together and exchanged among subcommittees so they could each review what the others had done, and then the master list of recommendations came together, I think, about June of last year . And since that time, I 'm thinking the staff has really been looking at all of these recommendations to ferret out which ones are really doable and how they can be implemented. And one of the things that, you know, I 've heard, just being on another committee, is that sometimes the recommendations of the Green Committee might conflict with a goal of someplace else that we have . For example, if the Green Ribbon Committee is saying "we need less impervious surface" , and then we ' ve got bikes and trails over here saying "we want curbs and gutters and sidewalks and a better delineated trailways and so forth" , they ' ll say "whoops, do we have one goal conflicting with another" ? So, it ' s been quite a process to determine what are those things that can be done and what we need to have a little bit more work on. But I think the neat thing is seeing all of this discussion and all these recommendations being given this careful consideration by staff, recognizing that some things can be done fairly easily, other things are a little more difficult to do, and other things we might need to go back and revisit a little bit and say "well, what is the right thing to do and how can we do it" ? But when we talk about water quality, we ' re talking about stormwater, and then, of course, the education component is so important . So, I think the work that staff has done with what the Green Ribbon Committee came up with, and like I say, that was a lot of folks who put in a lot of hours and we know that everything can ' t be implemented right away, but knowing that the staff has taken the concerns to heart and have been working on trying to see what we can do to reach those goals that we find that we all really want to reach is good. But then, one of the really big topic things I think all the three sub-committees and then the overall said was that the City needs to set the standard in our projects . And I 'm sure this is why you ' re talking about retrofitting some of these areas that maybe weren ' t done correctly. If we ' re going to ask our citizens and so forth to meet certain standards, the City has to set the standard, and that ' s a very important part of it . 27 So, this is sort of coming to fruition, what was talked about, that there will be some cost to reaching this water quality level . And then we had, of course, the Town Meeting on these recommendations and that was so well attended. And I think we know that this is something our citizens are concerned about, water quality, and we all have to maybe change some of our habits, but that also costs a little bit of money. So, here we are . I guess this is the fruits of the labor of that committee . It has been a while since that report was given, but it takes time to get these things worked out . So, I ' d just say that I appreciate all the work that the Stormwater folks have been doing to look at those recommendations . MARK JOHNSON: Thank you. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Thanks . I just had a couple of general questions with respect to the maintenance and things like that you were talking about . With respect to the stormwater utility fee increase, you talked about the different things that would go on with that . We talked a little bit about street sweeping. At what point is it the responsibility of the home owner to keep the gutter in front of their property clean, and at what point does it become the City' s responsibility? MARK JOHNSON: Well, actually, I believe that it ' s in the City Code that the property owner is responsible for the sidewalk and curb and gutter and keeping it clean. I think most of the neighborhoods throughout the City of Virginia Beach actually do that . We have, I think, the majority of our residents are very environmentally conscious . I think they keep their part of the curb and gutter clean. Our residents bag their leaves . They don ' t just rake them out into the street and hope the City comes by to pick them up. So, it is the residents ' responsibility, and I think overall they' re doing a pretty good job out there . COUNCILMAN WOOD: But the responsibility for enforcing that is probably Housing? MARK JOHNSON: Probably, Housing, I guess . COUNCILMAN WOOD: One of the other things that came out, and I served on the Stormwater 28 Subcommittee, the Green Ribbon Committee, was talking about the curb inlets and drop inlets and things like that that actually dump straight into the river . And I didn ' t really see anything in this to address any sort of protection or retrofitting of those, and I know we have I don ' t know how many hundred that dump directly into the river, and I know we ' ve gotten price quotes of up to $100, 000 per inlet and that sort of thing. Has that been addressed anywhere in this? MARK JOHNSON: Possibly in some locations . I think what you need to do is look at the drainage area that you have those systems and determine the appropriate best management practice . It may be the appropriate best management practice is beef up street sweeping. It may be that the drainage area that that inlet serves is so small that you can put in some sort of filter inside the inlet, and that would be your best management practice for that direct pipe outfall system. It may be that the drainage area that that outfall serves is large enough where it makes sense to go down to the end or right next to it build a dry pond or a wet pond and reroute the water through there before you discharge it to the creek or the river. So, that ' s the challenge we have, is trying to identify what is the best management practice for that specific drainage area, and what are we really trying to attack; is it bacteria? Is it sediment? Is it nitrogen? Is it phosphorous? Is it all of it, and really try and hone in and address that? And then from my perspective, I 've got to look at that best management practice and determine is it maintainable . COUNCILMAN WOOD: You hit actually on my next point, and I don ' t know, it may be one of the recommendations of the Green Ribbon Committee that fell through the cracks between departments, but when you say the best management practice, obviously, keeping the stuff from going into the drop inlet or the curb inlet is what you really want . You just want treated water or cleaner water going there . And one of the things that we had talked about was incentivising people to plant things along the curb lines and that sort of thing to keep the water from running directly into the curb inlet during a rain event before it ' s treated through a mini-BMP or a rain garden or buffer garden or whatever you want to call it . And I don ' t know if that ' s Planning or if that ' s Public Works or who is looking at that, but at some point it ' s obviously better if we treat the source as opposed to that . Who ' s taking that? 29 MARK JOHNSON: Mr . Wood, that ' s shown on the summary of the Green Ribbon Task Force, where Planning is the lead, of course, but Public Works has its important role and we ' ll work with them on trying to craft an ordinance to address that very thing . But it hasn' t fallen through the cracks, but insofar as today' s Public Works Stormwater presentation what we presented were the two top recommendations that were assigned to Public Works as lead. Those were that Comprehensive Management Plan and the Retrofit of Existing City Facilities . COUNCILMAN WOOD: And then one other question, and my final question, is enforcement of E and S, erosion and sediment control, on construction sites , who does that? Is that Permits or is that you guys? MARK JOHNSON: It ' s Permits . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Because I drive by and there ' s still houses under construction regardless of what you read in the newspaper, and I drive by all the time and see that there ' s mud being tracked out on the street and silt fences are down and that sort of thing, and obviously that ' s not healthy for the watershed. How do we get Planning and Public Works together on that? And I would also say that it seems to me the City has done a much better job recently in policing itself and doing that sort of thing. It used to be when Public Utilities or Public Works would dig up the street, they ' d have to put a big pile of dirt right beside the curb inlet with nothing at all, and that ' s kind of going against the grain. MARK JOHNSON: We are together with Planning on that . We certainly work with them on the Ordinances and so forth and review of development plans, but the resource, the capability for inspection and so forth, resides in that department . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Say that again, because I think the point Mr . Wood has made is really important . You all, you have Planning, they understand, and they are siting them and making them. I 'm not so much interested -- they need to be cited if they don ' t do it, but there are too many sites that too many people notice this very problem that Jim has, so maybe you all are doing the educating and just not getting through. MARK JOHNSON: I 'm not sure quite how to respond. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Well, you don ' t have to answer . I 'm 30 just -- COUNCILMAN WOOD: I , actually, my question is, I guess, if a Public Works Inspector is driving down the road and sees a house under construction, even though it ' s not in his domain, and he notices that there ' s improper E and S controls, will the Public Works Inspector call Planning? MARK JOHNSON: Let me say this, prior to development, Planning Inspectors, Civil Inspectors, inspect those . City projects, we have our inspectors inspecting, and it ' s probably a little easier because we paid a contractor, and if he ' s not doing right he doesn ' t get paid. So, we 've got a stick on our guys . Maintenance work by City forces, we police ourselves . If we ' re not doing right, we ' ll make sure we ' re doing right . I am sure if a Public Works Inspector drives by a private development and he knows the Civil Inspector, most probably he will give him a call and let him know something is going on with a project that he ' s responsible for. We do communicate with each other . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Thanks . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Are we at the end of Public Works now? I see the summary there . JASON COSBY: That was it . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: So, any of those that we didn ' t talk about in-depth, now is the time? MARK JOHNSON: That is last week ' s slide . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I didn ' t know if this was the end of all Public Works . JASON COSBY: For those segments , yes, this is the end of Public Works . This is just the other divisions we have in Public Works, just to let you know that . The only four discussions that you had previously, Stormwater, Capital, Transportation, and Operations . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: But I was looking at, for example, the Coastal Programs . I mean, if we want to talk about it, now is the time, because we weren ' t planning a -- I bother Phil Roehrs so much during the year 31 about the Sandbridge project, I didn ' t want you to get away. I would be remiss if I didn ' t say something about the Sandbridge Beach restoration. Of course, the project was done last year for the restoration. Of course, it was in the year before . I guess, it shows up as a 2007 project; that ' s why the three-year project says it would come again in 2010 . JASON COSBY: Correct, correct . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: The whole funding thing is a concern, because we set it up initially as 65/35 funding, with the Federal Government being the 65 and local being 35 . And I think we ' ve probably come to the conclusion that we better be prepared to do 100% local, and if we get any Federal we ' re lucky. I would just comment to pass on what I hear from the folks at Sandbridge . Of course, they ' ve got the Special Service District and they ' ve got the TIF, and it ' s been so successful . And the beach replenishment has caused the property values to go up so high that we have the ability within the TIF to bring some of the money over and above what ' s needed for the sand project back to the General Fund. So, they are not only paying for the beach replenishment with the SSD and the TIF but are also able to return some of that TIF over and above, of course, the base back to the General Fund. But it ' s also important that we remember that we have committed to the folks at Sandbridge that we would always have enough for two projects, in case there ' s an emergency need. And I just want to keep reminding everybody that we have been fortunate to be able to utilize additional money from the TIF, but we always need to make certain that we 've got enough for that emergency project , as well as the next one on the queue . And now that we ' re probably going to have to be planning for the worst-case scenario, and this is no Federal money, then it will take a little bit more . Of course, we were very fortunate to be able to get that project last year and a good bid, I guess, because nobody else was doing any sand replenishment since the Feds didn ' t have any money out there, and able to do even above what had been proposed. So, it worked out to the good for Sandbridge, but this is a continuous concern, and I ' d just put it back on the table . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Just so I 'm clear, is part of their money that they ' re paying to get the beach replenishment portion to match, are you saying now that it would be better not to have it used as any part of any 32 other; that it be segregated to be held for the, God forbid, doomsday storm? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: No, not really. Now, of course, and this is something that Catheryn and I have been going down to Sandbridge just before the budget comes out each year to go over all of this with the folks there so they' re comfortable before we make these recommendations, there are two pots of money. The Special Service District, where they are now paying 6 cents additional on the real estate tax, it had been as much as 12 , but now it ' s down to 6 because when their property values went up so much that amount of money accumulates more . And so, that Special Service District money where they ' re paying the additional money, that is only used for Sandbridge sand; we don ' t take any of that back to the City. But when we established the TIF, that was sort of the security, because there needed to be more than was being generated by the Special Service District . So, the TIF, of course, has the base amount which goes in the General Fund, but all over that base amount, that goes to the TIF . And it ' s that excess money that has been able to come back, after we have met the obligations to Sandbridge sand, because those property values have gone up so much, it ' s generating so much more than it had, because the TIF has been so successful and because the sand replenishment has been such a boon to their ability to improve the property values . It ' s that money over and above, so that the TIF money is really money that they would be paying anyway, but they get to make certain that the sand project is going to be paid. But it ' s important to keep those two separate funds clear . We have never taken any money out of what they are paying over and above; that always goes to sand. It ' s just from the TIF, when there ' s money over and above what it would take to do the sand projects and to keep this commitment that we ' re able to bring some back. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Wilson? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Is there any of the TIF money being pulled out for General Fund this year? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: $9 million. A lot to the Schools . CATHERYN WHITESELL: Yes, but it ' s split according to the formula 51% to the School System for School-related projects . 33 COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And how much is staying in the TIF? CATHERYN WHITESELL: I 'm not sure what the balance is right now. I can get that for you. But the commitment we have to the Sandbridge residents is we will accumulate enough to do two sand replenishment projects . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: So, if we could figure out how much that money is and how much money will be left? CATHERYN WHITESELL: Yes , we provide an annual report to them. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: But, again, thinking that we ' ve got to be able to figure that it might have to be the total amount, because, like I say, that 65/35 is probably a gone thing, even though when we started this we had the commitment from the Corps of Engineers that would be for fifty years, but somebody doesn ' t have to keep those commitments because we ' re probably not going to get 65/35 . We ' d be lucky if it ' s the other way around, 35/65 , and that probably won ' t happen. So, the amount of money that we ' re going to have to keep in order to do that, two projects; it ' s going to be more now that we ' re not getting the Federal money, but we need to -- COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Do we know for sure we ' re not getting the Federal money? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, we don ' t know for sure, but I think we can pretty well suspect . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: I mean, every year the President takes it out and then our Delegation has gotten it back in there . So, do we have any indication? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, they didn ' t get it in last time. CITY MANAGER: It hasn ' t been in the budget since even during the Clinton Administration, basically, hasn ' t been added. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Except for , I think, most of the time I think we missed a cycle, it ' s been put back in. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I 've been asking around folks 34 whether or not, folks who know a lot more than I do, whether they think that it will come back, and the quick answer I get is no . So, I think we have to prepare for the worst, and if we get better, then great, but I think we have to be able to expect that we 've got to do it, even if we don ' t get Federal money. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. CITY MANAGER: We ' re ready at this point, I guess , to go on to Public Utilities . Does Council want to take a five minute break? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes, thank you. DAVE HANSEN: I think we ' re going to do Facilities next . (Whereupon, the discussion of these matters were concluded. ) 3 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN 10:45 A.M. Mr. Barry Shockley, Director—Facilities Management provided the attached presentation, which is attached and made a part of these proceedings, along with the Verbatim Transcript. The City Council RECESSED for lunch at 11:55 A.M. April 15, 2008 ,. (I) , (i) , i___ _ a) —f L. D I - -I-0 V ( ) (o i CD [ I = 0c O E' O �, CD N d) a) 1.6 r �O �C c \ :-.) C 0 co 0 C i L_(v) a) u)>, , Q 03 �,E COcI3 u) cT3 F. al flc ' . .,_ E o W 0 0 ,__ I ( ) ) = 0 I- i."' irC 1**1 � a4M 'Ori4y't1 a, . .> L _ 0 cu a, •F L O m L v Cti C) 03 O �0 E m cD N N V -a w i Lcri #+ co. 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O Q) L (� L QD � � � � •� > ALL O :6- 0 O < < Q L c) cn •� � � o O 00E -C W CZ � •LW 0 ari> > 05 - -1Ei 0) C) CO C (1) C 0 i Q _ C6 (a a) Nscp O U :f2 CO Q (I3 (o a E I •czwO � 2 X0220 a) Emm a (n (z m a W m000000 > 000 E CI 0 0 0 0 Q 0 Cnw2 E E o o a) C a--' (1) 0 w >, E 'L }, o E ca O E oo •L a) 0 CD sIn' 0 O O LCD T15 "5 > "5 N . ii. C Q Q CC O co N cn 0 O E CO O C � �5 o — Q N C N *a C7 U >' 4= V - Nm > 0cn Q Cl) 0 0 02 L 0- ' - s!.. y 00u) co -0 w O O o co ca Q N 0 0 O 2 d =C CD ca U) -. Q . O p .0 0 1 •O V CO 0.= = O rz c6 C = a) W a a� -0 0 12 0 co _ ca t E U) 5 = , m o a LTD 0 c = maw 0 C E C T c 3 I— 0 0' E C L Cr) N 0 W 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 0 1 VIRGINIA BEACH CITY COUNCIL April 15 , 2008 10 : 45 a .m. CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FACILITIES VERBATIM CITY COUNCIL Meyera E . Oberndorf, Mayor At-Large Louis R. Jones, Vice-Mayor Bayside - District 4 William R. DeSteph At-Large Harry E . Diezel Kempsville - District 2 Robert M. Dyer Centerville - District 1 Barbara M. Henley Princess Anne - District 7 Reba S . McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E . Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L. Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS 2 CITY MANAGER: We actually need to do Facilities, and Barry Shockley is here to do that . BARRY SHOCKLEY: Good morning . I 'm Barry Shockley with the Department of Management Services, the Facilities Management office, and I oversee that group, and we ' re the ones that program the CIP for Buildings . Today, we ' re going to update y' all on what Mr . Hansen has talked with you all on several occasions for, and that ' s our Top 13 Priorities for the City and where it is in the CIP . Also, Mark Gemender, from Public Works, will be coming on to talk about the Maintenance portion of Buildings, once we get to that point . So, with that, I 'm not going to repeat this ; you all have seen this numerous times, but, again, the Top 13 is what we have focused on and continue to focus on in our planning . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: May I ask a question at this point? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes, ma ' am? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I keep seeing "replacement of the Courthouse Fire Station" in different things , and that ' s not been on this list and it ' s just sort of popped up; where has that come from? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Courthouse? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Yes . It ' s even in the City Page today, I think. And I have to say, I 've got a conflict talking about that because my son works out of there, but I was surprised to start seeing it . I think I 've seen it somewhere maybe in the Executive Summary and so forth. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Thalia is what it says over here, and then Blackwater, Barbara . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I know, I know, but, I mean, it hasn' t been on our list as being one of the priorities . I mean, but I don ' t see Blackwater sometimes, but I see Courthouse, and I just wondered where that came from. BARRY SHOCKLEY: It is the three that were just mentioned is what ' s on our list . CATHERYN WHITESELL: Mrs . Henley, there ' s a lot of -- 3 COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I know there ' s a lot of need. CATHERYN WHITESELL: -- that ' s beyond this list, and we ' re working to prioritize those and there are quite a few Fire Stations . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Because I think Kempsville has got some real needs and others, so I just wondered where we -- I thought I saw it this morning . I must have been half asleep . BARRY SHOCKLEY: In the "Requested But Not Funded" section of the Buildings section, like Catheryn was saying, most every Fire Station is mentioned for either a replacement, renovation, or some type of modification. Again, that ' s in the out years, we ' ll be coming back in the out years . Again, this Top 13 is what we determined is where we need to be as a City, try to focus on these . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, I see that the replacement of the Animal Control and K-9 Unit facilities is on there, and in that vein I want to thank the staff for having the meeting Saturday. It was well attended, and we had people from every walk of life who are interested in making it an adoption-friendly facility. And we had people working together that would not have ordinarily come together, and the speaker from Charlottesville who ' s running their facility up there was really dynamic . And I wanted to thank Chief Jacocks and the Police Department, because they have been extraordinary in their response and cooperation, and they are a real credit to the City in their effort to work with all of us to see to it that we are adoption friendly. There are number of recommendations that came out of the meeting, in addition to the facility, how we could advertise what dogs are there and are available for adoption, and cats and other pets . The other thing, we are now talking seriously about having the animals inoculated when they come into the facility so they don ' t get Parvo or Distemper or something that would make a whole slew of them ill, and the fact that at some point when we are able to afford to replace the facility, we make it more known how to find it, to come and look at adoption. We had the SPCA there . We even had PETA there, and just general people from the population who are interested in the issue . I ' d like to thank all of you for your response . If it had not been for the friends of Animal Control and their concern, they 4 were there also . And I just can ' t say enough good things about what is now under way and what will be adopted. I think the real measure of a community is how well you treat innocent animals , children, and the very elderly, who can ' t fend for themselves . And this is certainly a first step in the right direction, hopefully, to see to it that we become adoption friendly and that we can enjoy that facility for all to use and know that their pets are going to be cared for . BARRY SHOCKLEY: And that ' s really a nice little segue into where I 'm talking about . We are looking at replacing the current Animal Control facility, as we 've talked about in the past, for several things . One is just the age of it and trying to modernize it, like the Mayor was talking about, so that people are more excited, perhaps, in going to visit the facility and seeing what animals might be there to be offered. But anyway, come July 1, we will have in the CIP adopted money to begin the design of the replacement of both the Animal Control and the K-9 Shelter . We ' re anticipating this to take about a year, process of design, and start with construction money which comes in in July of 10 , the actual construction of those two facilities . And just in the interim, we have put a temporary building for the K-9 Officers , whose building is really in poor shape . This total project is about $3 . 6 million for both facilities, and the Animal Control will just about double in size from about 8 , 500 to 16 , 700, give or take; again, the design is not finalized yet . And the K-9 facility will jump from about 800 feet to about 2 , 400 , which will allow the K-9 Officers to store their gear and, not the animals, but their gear and all inside in a more proper place . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: May I ask? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: And maybe, looking at the next slide, it looks like you ' re going to something else . Just to refresh my memory, the Animal Control facility is going to be funded with the money from the increase in Dog Licenses? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: And now that people have started having to pay that, I started to get some e-mails and calls, can you refresh my memory on it; I thought there was still a distinction between animals that 5 were altered and those that weren ' t, but we had some ceiling that we had because of the General Assembly? So, tell me how that worked out . DAVID HANSEN: Our Ordinances currently have licensing fees for altered cats at $5 , altered dogs at $7 , and unaltered at $10 . We have not changed that Ordinance . The General Assembly has, I believe, moved to $17 , raised the cap to $17 , so that I think that ' s where we settled out . We had asked for $25 , and there was some negotiations with Senator Blevins, who was sponsoring that, and if Robert is here I ' ll get confirmation there. But I believe they finally settled out at about raising it off $10 , because State Code says there will be a differentiation between altered and non-altered. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: But even without that, we do still have a distinction of $3 difference . DAVID HANSEN: Yes , ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Because a couple of the calls I had gotten was "well, there ' s no difference" , but there is . DAVID HANSEN: Yes , ma ' am, there is . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I thought there was . But we may consider going up, now that the General Assembly has allowed it, or we may leave it like it is . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well , I can tell you it ' s up, because I have four dogs and both of my males are altered and both of the females are spayed. But when I came home, my husband grinned and said, " I just made a contribution to the City. " And I said, "What are you talking about? " He said, "The license has gone way up . " Plus , every year on the date that the vaccination for the rabies was given, that ' s when you have to know to go back in and pay for the next year ' s . So, it ' s going to get people ' s attention, because it ' s a great deal more than we had been paying for the same dogs in the past . Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Actually, it ' s not gone up that much. It goes up more if you do it in line with your rabies . So, if you have a two-years rabies or a three-years rabies , then it ' s going to be two or three times 6 what you were paying annually before . So, it ' s tied now to the date of the rabies expiration. And you can actually do it for two years or three years, but in the past you didn ' t have that opportunity. So, you ' re not going to, I mean, certainly it ' s a little more now, but you ' re not going to have to come back every year; you ' re going to go back every two or three years , whichever coincides with your rabies shot . MAYOR OBERNDORF: I 'm an overanxious mother . I 'm going to make sure my dogs are up to date every year just to be certain. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: The Animal Control, that is being paid with these fees ; what about K-9? DAVID HANSEN: We lumped them as one project . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: So, the license fee increases are paying for both the Animal Control and the K-9? DAVID HANSEN: Right . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: And what portion, how much of it is K-9 , and how much of it is -- DAVID HANSEN: Ma ' am, as we work and refine our estimates, 2 , 400 square feet, 16 , 000 square feet, we ' re finding out as we study more of the new current versions of Animal Control Shelters, the different HVAC and the quarantine requirements associated with keeping air quality separate from the main population, and we ' re getting into it . But I would say that it ' s probably, if I had to guess, it ' s probably one-eighth of the cost is going to go into K-9 and the lion ' s share, seven-eighth' s of that, is going to have to go into that Animal Control . It ' s a lot more involved than just slapping some cinderblock up there and dividing it up; it ' s really a lot . And those sessions that the Mayor alluded to are being able to help us with our design criteria . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan was there on Saturday, and I thank her for being part of the discussion. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: But we are going to show the design after it ' s put together to the public so they will have an opportunity? DAVID HANSEN: Our vision is that we ' ll probably 7 have a second forum in the same fashion that you just went through on Saturday, and we ' ll probably focus in on the facility more than the operational aspects . And I think y ' all have got your fingers on the pulse of the operational aspects and start to open those doors, and then we ' ll bring them back. That was a great forum with the right people, right stakeholders, and we ' ll bring them back to talk about the location of that facility and what ' s in it and how it looks and how it is adoption friendly. So, yes, ma ' am, we will . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Wilson? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: I think it ' s really important when people pay for these increased fees that they' re informed that the additional money is going to pay for a facility that ' s for animals, and I don ' t know if we ' re doing that or not . But do we have, like when they pay their fee, something to hand them to say there ' s an increase in fee and the reason why? I think people feel better about these things, rather than thinking "oh, gosh, it ' s just going into the City ' s General Fund" . If they know that it ' s going directly to help an Animal Control facility, they may feel better about that . DAVID HANSEN: Mrs . Wilson, you ' re exactly right . I 've been interacting with these stakeholder groups . They have put on the table a large number of requirements associated with developing a more adoption-friendly process . Each one of those requirements requires resourcing, as we get into deciding what the cost of those requirements are, and we ' re going to energize those stakeholders to help raise what is currently below 10% compliance in the city with registration of those pets . And we ' re going to do a large marketing program to make people aware that they ' re going to be contributing to moving us towards better Animal Control adoption and a more functional and up-to-date shelter . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And are we still planning on keeping this under the Police Department? DAVID HANSEN: I think it ' s premature to say that , Mrs . Wilson. I think this group that met on Saturday, there ' s a lot of recommendations out there . I don ' t want to predetermine outcomes . I think we need to let this work itself out . We ' ll be listening in Town Hall fashion by bulletized comments . All the inputs that we got on Saturday, the scribes are working diligently to decipher some of the handwriting . And then once we get it categorized, 8 we ' ll be producing that in a report to City Council and to the public to review, posting it on our website . And then I think we ' ll move down that road of determining, because we are looking at ways of doing it differently than we have currently in place . MAYOR OBERNDORF: And it was so nice because the Police Chief, himself, welcomed everyone, so there is not the tension or the friction; there is going to be cooperation, I think, for sure between everyone who cares about the animals . That ' s where we were headed Saturday, and the Police that were there were terrific, as were the volunteers from the Friends of the Animal Control, and all the other people who came even from Richmond to let us know what they' re doing there . So, thank you very much. BARRY SHOCKLEY: The next one is City Wide and Parks Maintenance . As y ' all will recall , Mr . Hansen talked with y ' all about this just a few weeks ago, and on the strategy that is proposed in order to replace these facilities using the property, itself, as the bill payer . Just a quick update on that, we are still in active discussions with the National Park Service, as y ' all had asked us to continue to flesh this out, working through the issues to get the deed restrictions that are currently on that property in the state where we can transfer them to an acceptable City property and from there move forward with this project with y' all ' s concurrence . But, again, just as a reminder, we are looking at for the City Wide programs about $3 . 7 million to replace that facility, and also for the Parks Maintenance to relocate that about $2 . 3 million, but neither of these are in the Proposed CIP; again, waiting to see what happens with this excess property program. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I 've got a question. BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes, sir? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Didn ' t the original estimate from Parks and Rec indicate they needed about 12 , 000 square feet? I see we ' ve got 20 up there . BARRY SHOCKLEY: What this number includes is the inclusion of the administrative offices, which are over here in Building 21 , to relocate, to centralize that whole operation. But you ' re absolutely right, City Wide, it was in the 12 , 000 range . The next project on the list was Resort Maintenance . Just as a reminder, this is in the middle of a neighborhood at 14th 9 and Parks . The footprint of that yard is certainly too small to support its current operation, plus the compatibility of an industrial operation in a neighborhood in the Resort area, as y' all probably know, they start up during the summer season at three and four o ' clock in the morning, so there ' s a lot of activities that are happening in those yards . So, we ' re looking to relocate that, again, using the sale of the property as a bill payer, and trying to find a location probably in the Birdneck Road/General Booth area. Again, that is not in the Proposed CIP. COUNCILMAN UHRIN: It is not? BARRY SHOCKLEY: It is not, but, again, using the same strategy that we would use for City Wide to see if that would work for this one, as well . COUNCILMAN UHRIN: We have no deed restrictions on that? BARRY SHOCKLEY: There are no deed restrictions on that . COUNCILMAN UHRIN: Is there any clean-up that we ' d anticipate? BARRY SHOCKLEY: I suspect we do have clean-up there . Part of that yard was a former mosquito control yard. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Jones? VICE-MAYOR JONES: How big is that piece of property, Barry? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Which one? VICE-MAYOR JONES : The one you ' re selling there? BARRY SHOCKLEY: It is right at an acre, a little bit better than an acre, if my memory serves me correctly. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Back on that, would we also consider looking at properties in and around Oceana that are in the APZ-1 area, because this would seem like a very compatible and good fit? BARRY SHOCKLEY: The answer is, yes , sir, we are doing 10 that . The constraint is that we want to have fueling station capabilities there, and in the APZ there ' s some restrictions on fuel in those particular zones, but it ' s certainly something that we consider in every property that we ' re evaluating . The next project would be the construction of a Large Vehicle Garage, and this would be part of our City Garage operation on Leroy Drive . As we ' ve talked about for the last number of years, the current facility has no longer the capability to support some of the equipment the Fire Department needs now for its mission. Lots of equipment is worked on outdoors during whatever the elements are at that particular time simply because of the sense of urgency. This project is funded in Year 3 of the CIP at just under $1 . 8 million to provide a 10 , 000-plus square foot facility that would concentrate on large vehicles; not only Fire equipment, but other large equipment that the City has, and this one is included in the CIP . The next project is our Euclid Yard. This is another property that we would want to use excess property to fund the improvements . Let me clarify this, we ' re not looking to sell this property. This is a strategic location for a maintenance facility to support the western part of the city. This area down here is a fueling site, so to relocate would be quite costly, as well as, again, the area is very capable of supporting the Bayside area and other western parts with bulk material , supplies, and equipment . This is not in the proposed CIP, but, again, we would want to consider this for any excess property that might be used to do the upgrading of the facilities . And we would mirror this much like we would do with the Beach Maintenance Yard with a site, adapt a similar building at this place . The next project is the EMS/Treasurer, and just as a reminder, this is at the Dome Site . These are the last two remaining City facilities that are in operation there . Anticipating what may happen in the future, we ' re looking at what can we do in the interim to deal with this . We have talked about in the past the construction of a facility for both of these facilities , but at this point in time we ' re looking at just trying to find leases for EMS and leases for the Treasurer ' s Office to meet their needs . And funding for the EMS will be in place July 1 , if we are able to execute a lease with that . And as an aside, just, again, a few weeks ago we were talking about that here, and we have now developed an RFP for this property, and it will be competitively sold, and we will use that model in the future, as well . 11 COUNCILMAN WOOD: Madam Mayor? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes , sir, Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: I think I just heard you say it when I was raising my hand, but you are going to use that process forward for all City leases? BARRY SHOCKLEY: We are going to be using an RFP process for this particular building. At that point, we ' re going to evaluate . There may be some ways to still seek competitive offers without the RFP process , but we ' re going to go through the RFP, see how that works, and from there see if there are other opportunities that still provide the same outcome but maybe just not as formalized as the RFP, itself . COUNCILMAN WOOD: How much space does the City lease? BARRY SHOCKLEY: The City leases right now about 246 , 000 square feet of office space . Now, we also lease land, and if we include that we ' re over a million. COUNCILMAN WOOD: In terms of office space, we lease 246 , 000 square feet? BARRY SHOCKLEY: And that ' s a combination of General Government and we have a major component in Human Services that lease space . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Right, and they occupy a great deal of Pembroke Office Park and places like that . BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes, sir . COUNCILMAN WOOD: And I really think that you need to use this RFP process across the board, because I think, I know, they ' ve been in that same place at Pembroke Office Park twenty-plus years, I 'm sure . But I think if we put this out in the competitive market, we may find that there are other places that are willing to step up and perhaps modernize or it could be useful for that . I 'm not just specifically saying that, but I think for all 246 , 000 square feet, I really think we need to, any time we spend City dollars, we need to do a competitive bid type of process . wherever possible, and I think real estate is no exception . BARRY SHOCKLEY: And we certainly can do that . We ' re 12 monitoring our leases . As they come up for notification for renewal, we ' re certainly going to make sure that we ' re competitive in what rates we can get, how we can make that happen to the general realtor world. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I support when I think there is a fairness , times change, the availability. But what I wanted to ask is, are you all going to give us a document that not only shows how much space we lease but how many people we have working in the different buildings? I know that ' s a rather large question, but I ' ve had questions come up recently about how many people, how many employees, work in that building, and then I had a City employee tell me that I was totally wrong about one of ours, many more people in the building than I had thought . Is it possible for us to have some idea, for instance, how many employees and which departments are in this building and over across the street and just all around the City? BARRY SHOCKLEY: You ' re talking about not just leased buildings, but all City facilities? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Yes, all City, so that I know how many people are scattered around the city in different places, just a little list with several pages . I know there ' s no such thing as a little list . BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , ma ' am, we could put that together . That ' s something we don ' t have readily available . We can certainly put it together and give you a good shot at it . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I think it might help us, in terms of looking at where some of our future, I mean, you look at certain things for the future needs of this City. BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes, ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: And these buildings come up, we need to do this or we need to do that , but we, ourselves , need to know where the City properties are . And if we know how many square feet are leased in different areas for different reasons and so forth, I think it would be nice to know what we have . BARRY SHOCKLEY: We can certainly put that together, as well as all of our space is not 13 just for people but programs, as well . We can highlight that , as well, to show what is actually being offered, how many citizens are taking advantage of it . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: That would be wonderful . BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes, ma ' am, we can do that for you . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Similar to what Mrs . McClanan ' s asking for, can you give me a list of kind of a census of the office space; in other words, how much square footage we lease, where, what the lease rate is , and when the leases expire, terms of the lease, that sort of thing? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , sir, we can put that together for you, as well . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Thank you. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. BARRY SHOCKLEY: The next project is the Thalia Fire Station. Again, this has been an important structure that ' s going to be supporting the Town Center area. The current facility is way undersized, as well . The good news is that effective July 1, we ' ll have adequate funding to construct a new Fire/EMS Station. The challenge that ' s involved is still finding the land in the right location to place it, but we ' re working on that, as well , and hopefully there will be some good news in the near future that will show where this facility could be placed. The next project is our Police Department , Special Ops, Evidence, and Forensics complex. This is , again, one we 've talked about to be placed on Leroy Drive. There ' s funding available in years three and four for this complex to be built . Some 32 , 000 feet is what is anticipated at a cost of $4 . 8 million. Again, this will replace the Special Operations buildings that are out at Leroy Drive . This will relocate the Forensics Unit that ' s in our Public Safety building now, and, again, that ' s an industrial operation inside an administrative building . And also, it will give us relief for our Property and Evidence, which is in dire need of having some additional space for storage, especially if the laws change and we ' re required to keep evidence for longer periods of time . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Mayor, can I? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes, please, Mr . Wood, and then 14 Mrs . Henley? COUNCILMAN WOOD: With respect to this, does this include any money for retrofitting the Property and Evidence and Forensics in the Police Headquarters building to office space? BARRY SHOCKLEY: This is strictly trying to concentrate on the new facility. We ' ll have to come back, once we know what the program would be for those backfilled areas, which I suspect would be administrative space, but we ' ll have to come back with that . COUNCILMAN WOOD: But it occupies three-quarters of the basement, I guess, of the building? BARRY SHOCKLEY: The basement, itself, is the half to three-quarters, yes, sir . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Leroy Drive? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , ma ' am? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Of course, that ' s sort of a situation over there that ' s evolved over time. It started out, I guess, with what was named for Mr . Leroy Dixon and fixing all the vehicles of the City, and then it ' s grown with all these other things, but it ' s really kind of back on the edge of a swamp . Thinking in terms of the Stormwater Management, when we start the first design, I guess, with the Animal Control and K-9 and so forth, and we start designing, redesigning, Leroy Drive, I hope that we ' re going to put an awful lot of attention on the Stormwater, because that is an industrial facility over there and the impacts on that swamp can be great . And it ' s an opportunity to really upgrade that over there, but I hope that there will be a lot of consideration for the overall setting the standard with the City taking the lead and so forth. That ' s always kind of worried me that we ' ve got a lot of stuff over there that maybe is having some run-off impacts . So, I hope that ' s going to be on the radar . BARRY SHOCKLEY: And I think you ' re right on that . Just as a refresher, there ' s about 125 or 26 acres , total, on our Leroy Drive parcel, of which all but 34 acres are considered wetlands . So, we can ' t do a whole lot with it, but we certainly need to protect that . 15 With the construction of the Animal Control facility, we ' re going to improve that anyway just from the design. As you can imagine, designs for removal of the waste from Animal Control has changed drastically from the mid-70 ' s to today, so that ' s going to be one of the big ones . But you ' re right, we need to take that one step further and make sure we ' re protecting the wetlands further . The next project is the Chesapeake Beach Station. Again, this will have the adequate funding in the 6-Year Plan in years 3 and 4 . It ' s another good thing/bad thing. We ' ll have the money, but we ' re still working hard for a site for that, as well . Public Works Real Estate Office is in active negotiations for a site or a couple of sites now for that . And, again, hopefully the good news is we ' ll have the site before we have the money actually available to begin the construction. VICE-MAYOR JONES : Barry? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes, please, Mr . Jones? VICE-MAYOR JONES : I noticed on all three of the Fire Station projects, the cost, the price of development, has been cut significantly. And you say cost cutting and value engineering? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , sir . VICE-MAYOR JONES : Can you tell me what value engineering is? BARRY SHOCKLEY: We ' re looking at what are the basic functions that are required for the Fire Station to make sure that it meets those types of things, plus the types of construction techniques that may be used. Another question we might want to ask is do they actually need to be designed for a Category 2 hurricane, or can we design it for a lesser one, knowing we have other facilities that are stronger that we could relocate our forces during those bad times . VICE-MAYOR JONES : I 'm not complaining about you cutting the cost, but I wasn ' t sure what you were talking about . BARRY SHOCKLEY: We ' re just trying to look at what techniques could be used to try to allow funding that ' s available to meet the needs of the missions for the Fire Department . 16 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: And I think Mr. Jones hit on something I was going to ask at the very end. But you take a look at this picture and you look at the picture of the Thalia Fire Station, they ' re very simple buildings, and you look at some of the buildings we 've built now, I mean, they ' re very ornate, they' re very attractive buildings, but at the end of the day they ' re still fire stations where people work and sleep, and that ' s essentially it . And I think we need to be cognizant of the fact that we can build these buildings a lot less expensively and still have them just as functional . And, of course, the thing that I 've mentioned several times is when we build these buildings it ' s a lot cheaper to build a bigger building now than it is to build another building down the road. So, in my opinion, Thalia or Chesapeake Beach or any of these, if we have the opportunity to build additional square footage that won' t be occupied, whether it be an additional story or additional ground-floor space or anything like that that we can use later on for a satellite office for the Treasurer or for anybody that might need it, EMS, a permanent home for EMS or that sort of thing, I think we need to think about that . It just seems that we ' ve come through here, and we have all these facility needs lists, and it would be nice if the City actually owned property that was ready to be built out and occupied. BARRY SHOCKLEY: And we are doing that with especially fire stations ; what can we do differently? Can we put another floor on it? As you said, it ' s cheaper to add it now, whether we need it at this point in time, and then we can build it out as the needs are identified. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: If we had two-story fire stations, they could have a pole and slide down. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Wilson? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: The value engineering is sort of taking the Taj Mahal out of some of these buildings that have maybe become so ornate, so I 'm really glad that you ' re looking at doing that . The other thing I wanted to say is you go to the urban areas in New York and all, they do when you ' re looking at land cost, especially when it ' s near the beaches where it ' s not as plentiful and 17 much more expensive is to do the two-story urban-type buildings . BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes . And, again, I think you ' re right . I think you ' ll see in the future we start going vertical for a lot of buildings . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Well, as you travel, look at major cities around the country, most do not look upon fire stations as a place where they put in a lot of extra, because most of them have stations located on extremely high-value property. We seem to be building on high-value property, but it doesn' t seem to reduce -- we ' re not reducing the cost of the stations . I want fire stations that serve everybody and everything we need to serve . But my son, who just moved to Portland, was here a couple of weekends ago and he was questioning me, he ' s been faced with Portland, a city that uses a lot of older buildings, a lot of limited space . They've done a lot . I won ' t get into whether I agree or disagree with some of that stuff they were doing. But, anyway, in his asking me what we were doing, his big concern, he said to me, because he is a very strong Kellam Alum and I thought he was going to -- I didn ' t know what he was going to do when he heard we were thinking about replacing Kellam, and then when he heard the price, he said, "Well, if your fire stations are costing this much, it ' s no wonder that your schools are . . . " because his children are going to a school that ' s I don ' t know how old out there in Portland. It ' s a very good school, don ' t misunderstand me . But I think sometimes we have been so lucky in this city to keep these buildings down here and maintain the condition, and we have beautiful city facilities . And I know you have worked very hard helping us keep them, but I think sometimes when you get in a certain mode you have to realize maybe times are changing a little bit . And you seem to be aware of that , and I appreciate your acknowledging those others , because we have to respond to the public . And they have to think, "Well, if I were building that building what could I afford? What would I do? What I want may not be what I can afford. " BARRY SHOCKLEY: And I think that ' s one of the things we are doing now and will in the future is questioning more, "do you really need that? Is that something that ' s required to meet your mission, or is that something that ' s just a nice next step up or something" ? So, 18 we are trying to do that, both from what you might see from the exterior, as well as some of the inner workings, but, again, trying to build a facility that ' s sustainable . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Diezel? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I think Barry just added the caveat that I was looking for, because you design them around a 50-year basis, these Fire and Rescue facilities . If you decide to put a serious domestic hot water heater in a building housing fourteen or fifteen people, it won ' t work. You ' ll replace that nine or ten times, as opposed to the commercial side of it . I was surprised that a couple of our newer facilities, I mean, they ' re magnificent, but functionally I guess I 'm kind of conservative, not to the extent that we build pole barns and have trailers backed up to them where the fire fighters come out of it . But I would just ask you to be careful with that and not to substitute your judgement over the Fire Chief ' s judgement, in terms of what is functional and what is not . That ' s happened a couple of times, and every time it ' s happened it ' s cost the City money. BARRY SHOCKLEY: And I support what you ' re saying. We are supporting those operations and try to make sure we ' re designing something that meets the functional requirements . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Just one quick example, the Fire Station 19 there in Bob ' s area and Centerville, a very nice facility, very functional, in terms of its size, fairly small, about 7 , 500 square feet, I think, we had requested in the pre-construction plan that the parking lot be able to accommodate 80, 000-pound vehicle movement . Somebody behind us substituted the 15 , 000 mark, and I can tell you that within less than 12 months the entire parking lot was destroyed because of that and had to come back and redo it . That, Barry, should never happen. BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes, sir . And, Mr . Diezel, just as you will probably see in here, we do have a project in the upcoming CIP to do some work at that fire station because of what you just described. The next project I talked briefly about is the 4th Police Precinct . We 've had design money in for this project, itself , but what we ' re doing now is to evaluate the needs of the tenants there . We have the Police Department, we have Libraries, and we have Parks and Rec , we have open space 19 behind it . We also have parking issues in that area . So, what we want to do is to evaluate the needs of all these users and try to optimize the site, itself, and that probably will not take place for another few months to begin that process; again, looking at the overall site of which we own just under 10 acres there . MAYOR OBERNDORF: I appreciate that . When you look at the footprint of how much the 4th Precinct has to cover, plus bringing back any folks that have to be held for a while; it ' s unbelievable . And just from the Police coming in doing their shifts, trying to change equipment out of one car and into another, there ' s not enough room there . Mr . Dyer? COUNCILMAN DYER: Just to underscore what the Mayor says, a big concern in our area, and I think Harry' s also, Kempsville, where you live, is Police coverage and efficiency and things of that nature, and we are kind of the population at the center of the city out there with a lot of needs . So, once again, I would hope that this could somehow be a priority. It creates not only a morale problem but somewhat of a functionality problem that I think that we really have to address , once again, in terms of retention and a few other sidebar issues that are out there . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I am impacted greatly where I am, because part of that precinct serves -- COUNCILMAN DYER: Green run? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: -- well, through the western part of the District I represent . And I know the Police have switched that District line a couple of times there, and I keep saying I don ' t know what ' s going to happen in the future with the way the population is shifting and the Police impacts . But we really need to be sure that the points that are being made here are about where the Police and how the part of it that is over so far my way, getting from over there to over there, and Captain Lowe is very familiar with this . I used to talk with Captain Baker. I 've talked with all of the Captains quite a bit . They hear from me when I hear from people who don ' t like how long it takes to get it, and you can ' t blame the Police when the road system is not sufficient to allow the traffic to move as quickly as it needs 20 to . We 've got a problem and we can ' t -- I know, I saw your little statistics about how long it takes for Police calls, but I also know to get averages you ' ve got people up in this end to add things up and then divide to get averages . Extremely important, these discussions are . We 've got a lot of people and a lot of things happening, lot of things, crime-wise, whether we want to admit it or not . They don ' t all happen where we would choose. First of all, we ' d choose not to have it, but then once we have it the Police have to deal with it . BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , ma ' am. And again, that ' s why we wanted to make sure all the stakeholders are there, City, as well as the public ' s input, as well . The next project is our Landstown Yard facility on the Public Works side, as y' all are probably familiar . That is now Dam Neck Road next to the Farmer ' s Market or one neighborhood away from the Farmer ' s Market . But anyway, Public Utilities is pretty good in their facilities and what they have constructed over the years . Public Works has not had the same construction availability; they' ve got a lot of portable buildings that they use there . This project is to replace about 22 , 000 feet of portable buildings and the portable buildings they' ve got there are ones that used to be here at the complex that were portables for the Courtrooms . And they were moved back in the early 90 ' s, so you can just see the age that ' s on these buildings, themselves , again, trying to come up with a nicer working environment . Again, this isn ' t scheduled and we ' re still looking at what are the best options . VICE-MAYOR JONES : Madam Mayor? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes , please? VICE-MAYOR JONES : Are you talking about relocating or are you talking about just new buildings? BARRY SHOCKLEY: I think just replacement of the buildings . We did a study back in the late 90 ' s to see what it was going to take to relocate that yard, and we were at the hundred million dollar range, and that ' s not really surfaced back as where we need to be focusing. So, this would look at replacing the current facilities over there . 21 The next one, lucky 13 , is the Blackwater Fire Station. Again, we have design money that ' s already appropriated in the CIP for this, but this is another site that we want to look at the needs for both the Fire Service and Emergency Medical Services and Parks and Rec, because they all share that same site, to optimize that site for the community needs . And we have about just under 5 acres , total , there to work with on that project . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: If I may? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: We had an application for a cell tower across the street, and it ' s been on hold for several months because I think they were looking at replacing it on this site . I think there ' s a little tower there, and I know that ' s been on hold to look at that . I don ' t know how long the cell phone company feels that they have the ability to wait, but I 'm assuming part of the site design is looking into things like that . That ' s a consideration, that cell tower on this site? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Yes , ma ' am, because we do own that tower that ' s on the Blackwater site, and I do know there ' s been interest from at least one cell company of trying to rent space from us . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: How long do you think it will be before you are ready to have the site design so that that issue can be resolved? BARRY SHOCKLEY: Dave? DAVID HANSEN: Mrs . Henley, I think that we ' re going to be able to move forward with probably a competitive environment, looking at giving that cell tower up for private use . And I think that the footprint that we would expect them to do would be, of course, to reinforce the structure, tell us what they would -- multiple users , and then the support station that ' s at the base of most of those towers, a reasonable amount set aside there . And our team pretty much knows what that would be, so we ' d probably carve that out as a business opportunity and competitive mode and design around it . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I certainly don ' t want the cell tower to drive what goes on this site . 22 DAVID HANSEN: No, ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I think you want to do the job right, but I hope that we will be able to work something out so that we don ' t have to just do another site because this isn ' t available; that ' s part of the long range with this . DAVID HANSEN: That would be our intent, to make sure that we can stay there . BARRY SHOCKLEY: With that, just sort of a transition point that we talked about what we 've got planned, now we need to talk about our Maintenance needs . And with that, Mark Gemender from Public Works is here to talk to those subjects . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Before you get started, forgive me . I have a quick appointment I have to get to, and I ' ll be back for the rest of the briefing . Mr . Jones is kind enough to take over the conducting of this Workshop . I ' ll be back. Thank you . MARK GEMENDER: Vice Mayor, Members of Council, we want to take a few minutes to take a look at Council ' s commitment to Facilities Maintenance and how this year ' s budget compares to that commitment . Back in ' 99 , Council committed to adequately fund for facility degradation, maintenance, and aging infrastructure . A good indication, initial indication, on how well we ' re funded is a comparison of the maintenance dollars allocated to the overall current plant replacement value of what the City owns . Right now, the current plant replacement value is over half a billion dollars, including the new Conference Center . These are basically the same figures that Risk Management uses to asses valuations of our infrastructure . Our total Operating Budget, including our total Maintenance Budget, both the Operating Budget and the Capital Budget, is $20 million, $20 . 7 million, which equates to about 3 . 5% of the overall total infrastructure value, plant replacement value . That ' s a serious commitment on the part of Council , and the folks in Building Maintenance take that commitment seriously. Two years ago, we embarked on kind of a different plan on how we ' re going to do our maintenance planning for the City. It involves an Asset Management Plan, and key to the Asset Management Plan is having an accurate inventory of everything 23 that we own, and a condition assessment of everything that we own. A condition assessment is a very detailed inspection of each of our facilities, and we 've planned that out over the course of three to four years where we would phase in each of our, all 100% , of our facilities , and get an accurate view on what the current condition of the facilities are . What we received from this initiative is empirical data broken down into broad categories of work, and also included is a short, medium, and long-term, basically, Maintenance Action Plan from which we can take a strategic view instead of a reactive view of what we intend to do with the maintenance dollars that you allocate . It ' s very beneficial . As a matter of fact, the GFOA has endorsed this as a method to plan and program maintenance dollars . So, they ' ve kind of reinforced what Council did several years ago . This strategic plan gives us an opportunity to bundle similar types of work to gain value if we elect to award work to contractors . What this slide depicts is a projection of those, a long-term projection, six-year projection, of those types of categories of work that we intend to program throughout these next few years, and the total is about $84 million worth of work; represents the maintenance backlog for all the City-owned facilities . This slide shows a projected trend with the current funding levels on what our commitment is . If you take a look at this line here, that gives you the same type of percentage as part of plant replacement value for what we have . The fairly good range is between 2% and 4% of plant replacement value for maintenance, and that gets you in the ball park of whether or not we ' re adequately funded. Next one, we need to talk a little bit about energy issues, and what I ' d like to do is walk you through some past historic trends on how we looked with natural gas budgeting and expenditures for past years and also electrical . The variation between the budgeted amount, this chart depicts the variation between the budgeted amount year-by-year in the past and the projected amount for ' 07 and ' 08 , end-of-year ' 07 and ' 08 . The disparity between the budgeted and projected amount has been primarily because, with regard to electricity, because of usage, and we had about a 16% -- I 'm sorry, a 12% or 13% rate increase between ' 06 and ' 07 and ' 07 and ' 08 , and that accounts for some of that disparity. We ' ve had increased usage because the 911 Center came on and the Detention facility came on in prior years . Take a look at natural gas, primary reason of the disparity between budgeted and expended amounts is because of 24 fluctuations in rates . Up until last year, we were paying spot market rates for natural gas, the current spot market rate for natural gas . Last year, through Stand Energy, we locked in on a blocked rate for natural gas and a projected value per cubic foot of natural gas . We locked in on a $7 . 47 per MMBTU rate. We are currently, the current spot rate is $10 . 09 , so we are in a saving mode this year with regard to natural gas . As a matter of fact, we saved probably about $60 , 000 this year because we 've elected to lock in a rate for natural gas instead of floating with a spot rate throughout the year . So, to recap, we ' ve gone over the Top 13 . We acknowledge Council ' s commitment to Facilities Maintenance, and we take that commitment very seriously. And although our utility costs have risen substantially, as a matter of fact, I need to point this out with regard to energy, we had a Joint Energy Committee meeting, a committee that Dave Hansen put together, to get our arms around energy and particularly what ' s going on with our electricity bills throughout the city, including Schools, Building Maintenance, and also the Convention Center . A member of that committee is a Senior Account Manager with Dominion Power, and he acknowledged to us at our last meeting that a portion generates our rate; there ' s a fueling cost that forms as portion of our electricity rate . They' re going to be applying for an increase to that rate, the fuel rate . And although he can ' t provide us with a translation of what that ' s going to mean to our rates for next year, he did throw out between 10% and 15% as an indicator . So, we ' re looking at an additional increase for next year of some unknown amount that will become known within the next two months or so . VICE-MAYOR JONES: I think Mr . Villanueva had a question . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Thank you, Vice Mayor . Can you talk briefly a little bit about what we do for energy conservation? For instance, do all the managers tell all the staff to turn off their computers at night, flip the switch off, that kind of thing? I mean, those small things really help out . MARK GEMENDER: You ' re absolutely right . That ' s part of the reason why Mr . Hansen put together this Joint Energy Committee, which meets up here once a month now. We are taking a look at a number of ways to conserve . We are taking a look at projects that are funded to reduce energy consumption through replacement of pumps with 25 high-efficiency pumps, lighting improvement . But also, we went through this past year, the City Manager signed out a memo requesting that all Department Heads cut back on energy consumption. We changed temperature thermostat controls in both summer and winter months . The results of that have been mixed. We 've seen some improvements and some increases in cost, but we ' re still evaluating that . This Joint Energy Committee is engaged. We 've got the membership on that -- DAVID HANSEN: Mr. Villanueva, we 've had two meetings . We ' re having reports done . We 've got several staffing papers on the way. You mentioned specifically turning off computers . Schools made a decision to move about 45 days ago to shutting off their computers . Gwen is performing a staff study and going to give a policy report back. We ' ve moved to energy saving monitors . The savings on the current monitors that we use in the City, if turned off, will save you about the cost of a 60-watt light bulb. We ' re looking at when we have security patches coming in virtually anywhere from 13 to 25 times a week upgrading our security, any time you would turn back on your system you would have to wait 15 , 20 , minutes for that to download and then you ' d probably have to restart your computer so that those patches restart . So, we ' re having a complete energy savings and analysis with regards to our computer and automation use so that we can make the right decisions, not just jump without knowing what the facts are . We had the top ten energy hogs briefed to the Joint Committee . Schools is actively engaged. They 've centralized all of their energy costs . We ' re learning from them. Our energy costs are dispersed. We ' ve got it located in a couple of key centers . We ' ve got Dominion Power working with us on energy monitors, and we ' ll know when we ' re spiking inside the Convention Center; that ' s our biggest energy hog . And we ' ll try to see what we can do to reduce our peak usage and maybe do some sharing and some shaving that will bring some returns back to us . We are actively engaged in looking at and sharing information on best practices , and we brought in last month, as Mark said, the Account Executive from Dominion Power to be a part of this and work with us to help us bring about the right decisions and pursue the right things . We know and we have received a briefing from Schools, they ' re proceeding with two performance contracts that they've got going to their Schools and replace some of their lighting systems and moving to a more advanced lighting system. 26 We 've got several contractors that have been in contact with the City Manager, who has related them to the Joint Energy Committee so that we have an opportunity to look at their product, make sure that their product is state of the art and that we ' re not buying something that is kind of an antiquated system and there ' s better products on the market, because energy is a major technology-developing business , especially with the City of Virginia Beach. We are actively engaged and very concerned with that . We ' re looking at green buildings, green initiatives . I know that you all are very familiar with that . We ' re trying to look at whether or not Animal Control can initiate some of those green initiatives . What does a green roof really do for you? What ' s the cost? We are engaged with Schools . They say you get 20% return on a 2% cost increase . Show me the numbers . So, we ' re putting them through the drill, and it ' s not a -- it ' s a very collaborative, learning, sharing, environment, and it ' s helping them look at some of their processes; it ' s helping us look at ours . I know that ' s a long answer, but I want to take this opportunity to reassure Members of Council that the City Manager has directed for this upcoming year this special area of interest on his part, make sure the staff is collaborating with Schools to improve and be able to start to report back to Council on a quarterly basis where are we on energy and what are we doing to get our best bang for the buck. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Thank you. VICE-MAYOR JONES: Mr . Dyer? COUNCILMAN DYER: While we ' re on Facilities , I 've got a couple of e-mails of concern on the NIKE Site and the facility next to Bellamy Plantation about surveying being done in regard for future sale . Now, forgive me, but did we go ahead and approve this concept plan for those facilities, because right now the neighbors are upset about what potential development may be going there? And in terms of, once again, we ' re going to have a bucket of development going on there along the Princess Anne corridor and a number of projects , and they ' re concerned about an increase of houses, but also they ' re seeing a lot of retail closing down. And once again, with some of the traffic problems that we may be confronting in the future, why are people being given notices, and, once again, we really don ' t have a plan? 27 DAVID HANSEN: Mr . Dyer, I ' ll be happy to provide you the briefing that we gave several months ago to refresh your memory and the fact that working with the Department of the Interior we are required to provide certain legal documents associated with seven different areas that we have to provide, such as a complete survey. So, the survey data work that you ' re seeing going on out there is directly related to us being able to transfer the deed restrictions currently in place established by the Park Service, Department of the Army, back in ' 64 when we did it originally. So, we can pick that up and put it on top of open space, green space, park space, somewhere else, and then with that lifted we have opportunities to do whatever we wish to do . And I think everybody' s intention was that we would first remove those restrictions and then we would create or come back to Council on our project requirements for Parks and Recreation. And then we also committed, if you recall in that briefing, to meet with those Civic Organizations we identified that we were knowledgeable of who those organizations were and to sit with them and talk with them, "what would you like to see on these sites if the City decides to vacate and move Parks and Recreation out of those 1940 buildings and locate them at Parks and Rec, Princess Anne Commons " , our athletic complex there . COUNCILMAN DYER: You think it might have been more beneficial to talk to the Civic groups first before they just got these notices what ' s going on, because the thing is creating a lot of apprehension in those neighborhoods? And just getting notice on the door they' re being surveyed for a potential sale, I 'm going to get a copy of the actual document; once again, we ' ve got a couple of sensitive neighborhoods there that are sensitive to some of the traffic problems . Even with the NIKE Site where we were talking before about development, in terms of more flooding, and Rosemont Park, there ' s a lot of concerns that people in those neighborhoods have . And just to find out in the notice that we ' re evaluating for a sale, I really wish that the folks were informed what was going on, maybe some Civic meetings preemptively, because right now there ' s quite a stir going on in Bellamy Woods and Salem Woods -- Bellamy Plantation and Salem Woods . DAVID HANSEN: I would be happy to bring my team in. 28 COUNCILMAN DYER: I would appreciate that . DAVID HANSEN: And we ' ll get on their Agenda and come in and bring that briefing, and we ' ll notify you when we ' re committed to that . COUNCILMAN DYER: Thank you very much. DAVID HANSEN: Yes , sir . VICE-MAYOR JONES : Any more questions on Facilities? Thank you very much. (Whereupon, the discussion on Facilities was concluded. ) 4 Mayor Meyera E. Oberndorf re-called to order the CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP in the City Council Conference Room, on Tuesday, April 15, 2008, at 1:01 P.M Council Members Present: William R. "Bill" DeSteph, Harry E. Diezel, Robert M "Bob" Dyer, Barbara H. Henley, Louis R. Jones, Reba McClanan, Meyera E. Oberndorf John E. Uhrin, Ron A. Villanueva, Rosemary Wilson and James L. Wood Council Members Absent: None April 15, 2008 5 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFING PLANNING ITEMS PENDING 1:01 PM Jack Whitney, Director of Planning, detailed the Planning Items to be heard by the City Council on May 6, May 13 and May 27, 2008. Detailed items are hereby made a part of these proceedings. May 06, 2008 Nimmo Childcare John Sargent May 13, 2008 Weldenfield of Virginia, LLC ALCAR Suzanne McBride Deborah C. Hoover-Powers Jill C. Harris Denise N Thompson Elyse Herron Richard Irving Luxe Salon, LLC Today's Homes, Inc. May 27, 2008 R. Timothy Jr. and Kimberly W. Tepper Jonathans Cove Homeowners Assoc. T-Mobile Northeast, LLC NTelos New Cingular Wireless PCS, LLC t/a AT&T ESI Properties, II, LLC April 15, 2008 , it May 6 Items j • Nimmo Childcare (Modification of . ,„�,;; . - Proffers)–deferred on 2/26/08 and ..w. • — 4/1/08 44. • John Sargent(Nonconforming Use Enlargement)–deferred indefinitely I on 2/12/08 (with caveat that it return in 60 days) 1 l -�� L�l i� , / fl ' /i/(J:) M:tPet.* ohn Sar•ent e a.s.,. Nimmo Childcare& Resource Learnt!_ Center r�\�k��y�N�� rt a a '� • •�"- r'1(-III.‘ ��b �p----a"".".0.--.7,:::—._ �.t�'\� /z�. ---.5,71 v , — . Q9, *A,;14$146 s. 3' !. //Po i ', ® 6 41 , ,l...,...a,,w% '1;1 4 wq -1', v K-zo Q° AG-2 /�/ > V�A� - 0 ...-.-401\,. ,- Princess Anne District lynnhaven District 1 , i' Relevant Information =_'• =„ • The applicant requests approval of alterations _ • i 1 and enlargement of a nonconforming use.The ia d site is nonconforming because three(3)dwellings currently exist on the site. • The applicant hired a contractor to convert a 1 ; portion of the glassed-in porch on the rear of Unit ., .. .:;;;.=,_ 203 to living area,to rehabilitate and expand the utility room,and to add a new set of exterior stairs on the northern section of the structure. = T: • City Council deferred the application,directing ;1 ,'. � the applicant to(1)meet with the North End Civic League and(2)hire a design/construction professional to review,in conjunction with City �"W-71 staff,the work that has been done for compliance — —. •`•' " ' with the appropriate Codes. EV 1 'Ftit n . t May 13 Items 0. iiiihiiiiIij'' • Weldenfield(Change of Zoning) • ALCAR(Floodplain Variance and Change of Zoning) • Suzanne McBride(Use Permit) : • Deborah Hoover-Powers(Use Permit) ^) • Jill Harris(Use Permit) • Elyse Harris(Use Permit) • Denise Thompson(Use Permit) . • Rick Irving(Use Permit) • Luxe Salon(Use Permit) • Today's Homes(Amendment to PD-H1 Plan) 7 Relevant Information Weida; era o lir ma LLC • Applicant requests a Change of Zoning .07 4 � '' /4 from R-5D, I-1, and 0-2 to PD-H-2(R-5D) L, ri% for the purpose of developing a residential tqi:>-. . community laid out in neo-traditional 1111 41 style. �•! • There will be 69 single-family homes and ►'1:".- a ' 81 town homes(density=3.2 per acre). iiiik '�L Mrd z� • Project will be part of a larger mixed-use I.„,, 0 ` 4 development called the Villages of ti = Blenheim. Centerville District • AICUZ is Less than 65. Evaluation and 6A Recommendation . c) • Planning Staff recommended approval µ �:. • Planning Commission recommendsH i ;. approval (10-1) .,Ni:; ,:'; ,� ff w ` s +• No opposition. � B_ nt{T `444. d Weldenfield 3 'tisttrtr'in',\ \I S' E ii t „- r -tt-._-..1==ale=-"._"",.. "m.4-...^.=: ,..- Weldenfleld - 44 F" ALCAR q �e , Relevant Information °� R.o "mo ° • Applicant requests a Floodplain Variance and a r� °� Rezoning from AG-1 and AG-2 Agriculture to p4 ry_, .a•-• a, Conditional R-7.5 Residential to allow ',l .. '4'j development of site for 132 single-family homes. `_ � Density is lower than surrounding area. Site is located in a Sub-Area 2 of 65-70 AICUZ and ', .t+ the 70-75 AICUZ.No homes are located within the 70-75 AICUZ.City-Navy committee reviewed and iii, 65-70 dB Ldfl /1.4.1 4 "`" found the proposal met the criteria for Sub-Area 2. t-�- ° :��'1S • The volume of the mitigation areas exceeds the 9..'° ;;:�y�y1r 'n volume of fill within the floodplain by 2,203 Cubic .rl : 'g, Feet(C.F.)and all of the mitigation areas are ,(:ma _ ,y ';,, located outside and contiguous to the existing co�aunaizana�h,s rmm <,- ,<,' floodplain.Therefore,the mitigation proposed for Princess Anne District the floodplain fill meets the criteria for mitigation as defined by the ordinance. 4 Evaluation and NORTH ;,:..4,:„...-4,.,,,,,,...,..,..,:z.,,,• �, Recommendation 4 ?`.. ` t '` SPpr. in RI .., {; S th to Pk y pr P •.• • '{CLL). 9 g/� • Clf • Planning Staff recommended approval = ' r, ar; 41r R , ;'„", sr ' • Planning Commission recommends astkatoa .;y' :1 ;.ions r., approval (11-0) ;:rr5? • There was opposition. y �- NimmoParkwa i 1 9.1,P111111111.,:... ..- bear ,•OM i �4 111 Iii 11/1 11 - 111111111 III DI'ii9III re.. n N`� V. _ i svc - .... ,, . 4 ri sw.., 1. t-;..' > B 066604MI inMIIN '' ---- :.: III.II) Iill1 I i m 111 111 111 M lii 11' — = , ax .. 111 111 111 1 i � —, . -�� , 111 111 111 111 111 101 WWI=--- 111 111 lit 11 111 iii -s.,E.-. --- i 91 III OI a 0,111 ni WisAfilffi-7.11. N MM.QUAY iiiia. x s w tr LCAR, LLC ALCAR, LLC 11414.1m. 5 Relevant Information Suzanne McBride • ir, - L. =[2-rf e gi • Applicant requests a Conditional Use '~ Permit to allow Home-Based Wildlife 6, l sqt-. I , i °su �or Rehabilitation on the property. e r l+l II c u t 0p tr• ,►~X ® ssL, `-!� • Applicant has been rehabilitating wildlife • „.... :4r,.. .--1, `. ; la! �- on the site, unaware of the need for a Use ` �M� �G Permit.There have been no complaints to .�® ki ' v ;� 14 the Zoning Office pertaining to this use at A6,,-4-11..�Q� `��-..... .4 ©v�.;�'� i = this location. ''....'.51c. ,` dt E t; Q i; • Proposal meets the criteria for this use,as ..a • c$8. �.. r ' k. provided for in Section 242.3 of the Zoning Ordinance. Kempsville District • AICUZ is Less than 65. LOOKING NORTH Evaluation and , Recommendation • Planning Staff recommended approval , N,� la • Planning Commission recommends approval (11-0) • No opposition. Consent agenda. ” , f iv-_I" .^..... 4,,4, ,. s -, iN . Su,anne McBride 6 • ...... ., . • 77;7-'7,::.7=.77. i/--,_ •,, - i _ ,, . . •..... i 11610C: .. + .,..... .I •' E ,........, ',...e OW rOntrilki i f t tilri num Suzanne McBride I otio. i P. \ ' Is a, , ,tfui,tp I,•• ,, ,ro •—', • 5 / a ...- 5 . f h.* zt44 .,- v:". .,ipr.... •:,,k"..:...rrozi„Q OR ri,R „dr, ----- . . ,-... • ,--n,Ez___. -.-q; 4t,v4"1,-Ergor-,!,-.,.- ,-----17, ''''• ___ kintrik40.44. 'fole,AiNt-, "4,t 444,. ..7 . . i . ,. . ....„ Rose Hall District Suzanne McBride 7 Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Conditional Use Recommendation Permit to allow Home-Based Wildlife Rehabilitation on the property. • Planning Staff recommended approval • Applicant has been rehabilitating wildlife • Planning Commission recommends on the site, unaware of the need for a Use Permit.There have been no complaints to approval (11-0) the Zoning Office pertaining to this use at • No opposition. Consent agenda. this location. • Proposal meets the criteria for this use, as provided for in Section 242.3 of the Zoning Ordinance. • AICUZ is Less than 65. LOOKING NORTH ' o. ' { t Cry. mry @ it ' , - }".A P Atnbcdy Fui r• t PI_ e„r' r 4 144:SI SS INV eV I% INV m 444 Abodw y Foil ,t Road 04 8 u�,M f {I�ry 4 rvAM ill C.Harris © � fi .).Y O� ° pu t, a 7/Wttittratir '41tf.r4t/4 tic -4140;iy, %,/,..tetti dd a ;°i„„:7/4.Q I 1 rat s ? Lynnhaven District Deborah C.Hoover-Powers Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Conditional Use Recommendation Permit to allow Home-Based Wildlife Rehabilitation on the property. • Planning Staff recommended approval • Applicant has been rehabilitating wildlife • Planning Commission recommends on the site, unaware of the need for a Use approval (11-0) Permit. There have been no complaints to the Zoning Office pertaining to this use at • No opposition. Consent agenda. this location. • Proposal meets the criteria for this use, as provided for in Section 242.3 of the Zoning Ordinance. • AICUZ is Less than 65. 9 LOOKING NORTH Gc. ! 1 c • c ` 4.Nrf/ •n fit`�� ,rte Nr,rk R. �-. carne NECK mm c'' '' atOP 11 * 1400 N' ;II y yt� " �� IF : , •r r ,, „� ,,., a1 '11 y:'" ia' IMP fli[ :CT7+r• if ` Jill r. r } I ..n,44111/ta i ' I ' Jill C.HarrisM Ji11 C.Harris I0 Relevant Information •t•• Lx c�� / ti*t ��, w. • Applicant requests a Conditional Use - ,44i4 0�', o Permit to allow Home-Based Wildlife % Rehabilitation on the property. • Applicant has been rehabilitating wildlife m...��• ��• • •,•, /i on the site, unaware of the need for a Use //, '/-iPermit.There have been no complaints to p � %_�'-r the Zoning Office pertaining to this use at %i� / • _.G this location. /,I •i --"11°4410.1\—\ - • Proposal meets the criteria for this use, as 4, '0 %, ` provided for in Section 242.3 of the Zoning ,.,,. Ordinance. • AICUZ is Less than 65. Bayside District • 0.: LOOKING NORTH Evaluation and �ri. � � Recommendation • Planning Staff recommended approval • Planning Commission recommends Littl Creek � � approval (11-0) Reservoir f'.cr µ • No opposition. Consent agenda. '.,• r y ' I en tirayrirtrillillti-'" -• 11 �+ ; '1, , - - - ,,,,,,- ‘ --vw-,.‘, ▪ 'h•r 'yi R 111 , :, s • k{ ,, ,j d ' ,xilsi.,,,,.,' '; . ' d f — — 4 Iii t i P�+ Y d Yt '.Y .11' ; f ....1 P 4 . syn ,.,df. ` '• '"t'. • w, - `�S1fi- 5 A.' i,,. *4106, 4' .Iggeia .. ,. Denise N.Thompson_ - Denise N. !!! o! Relevant Information Elise Hereon • Applicant requests a Conditional Use 2` ' a Permit to allow Home-Based Wildlife y !�1,ia \\�i►`►��`"/�` ��`"� Rehabilitation on theproperty. T•4' y s � �, c `_� ^,mss`,, Applicant has been rehabilitating wildlife 44:444‘ !1.*-4.V 'i3,,'� on the site, unaware of the need for a Use c �4 3 " ��.'! a Permit. There have been no complaints to Z� s ' - o R ...1.1 � 4Tie the Zoning Office pertaining to this use at o,-g ......._, ,,ti.. ,,„,, . _- Wa .. Y Qr this location. ' � ` Gp 1 • Proposal meets the criteria for this use,as 4 y ` A1i r n1' : I �^Qs col.. �4 provided for in Section 242.3 of the Zoning (1,. w, ,,;r !' Ordinance. Lynn haven District • AICUZ is Less than 65. 12 LOOKING NORTH Shn,,D,v, Evaluation and r .01 Recommendation ,, .th • Planning Staff recommended approval `, `IR' . • Planning Commission recommends w, �1 ,. approval (11-0) • No opposition. Consent agenda. p,0F ._-11 ' .., Ls •. lyse ierron 'fit"Lt. dI ani 8 65 .a ;.:E' 27.7.7iFiatiorzliEiESP"iEFZ. 1/1f Vii*Id £ t ifri - Princess Anne District Elyse Ilerron 13 Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Conditional Use Recommendation Permit to allow for a residential kennel on the property. • Planning Staff recommended approval • There are currently six adult beagles • Planning Commission recommends and two four-month old pups on site. approval (11-0) • Applicant desires to keep a • No opposition. Consent agenda. maximum of 7 adult dogs. • Surrounding property is either owned by family members or is in the ARP program. • AICUZ is Less than 65. LOOKING NORTH i1; C„` N„11f.1 It1V I.„ I�rv' Tu Piwr .•. 1 Aiiii Ril. _le I , 7fi�"r"I't1f •t.! Richard Irving 14 4 4,f x 4 J 9 C � 3-44..0. i0. ts ''- f '� I rt, ` ,. 7 Richard Irvin ` _ rd Iran Relevant Information +°^ k; Luxe Salon LLC • Applicant requests a Conditional Use R 20�.• ---;-,J- t,B Ldn Permit to allow use of the third floor of the sut,AREn .,1' �_ R_20 existing building for a beauty salon. ' `�' ; • The first and second floors are currently ® ©°•"• °; occupied by professional service uses. SMS 70 d� % ♦ 'I,' Based on parking requirements for the c ! r3. professional service uses and this -�"� "'----R _ -su�'�'...i,---:-7 " proposed personal service establishment, IP * R l� there is sufficient parking to flI *rr��` 1 "u accommodate both uses on this site. Ef�l A/• ��• 4 Ira / R�/ • AICUZ is 65 to 70. Use is compatible in Princess Anne District this AICUZ. 15 s . LOOKING NORTH Evaluation and ... , Recommendation • Planning Staff recommended approval • Planning Commission recommends 0,coo' 7 _foo approval (11-0) • No opposition. Consent agenda. N n,m0 ParkWny Luxe Salon,LLC X � 6 _ Toda 's Hontcs lnr. WO.it0 ''. . -'.1::'''4. ' ' -7k;------- ----zoAkw, ,i i . ' , - ix '''''---:%.."•,-Alozrs .4,,,, tvo, i „. ...(!it*t. 5 ',.., -; a „rte, *' -- 1 i - i:-: ,..t, ,...___--zi,,,,r„0„, ...0 : ..L, imp if i„.,,z,„ ., r ►- ' Princess Anne District Luxe Salon,LLC u- 16 Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Modification of the PD-H Recommendation Land Use Plan for Village F of the Villages at West Neck. • Planning Staff recommended approval • The applicant desires to construct single-family dwelling units that are of a different size than • Planning Commission recommends what the original developer intended. approval (10-0-1) • Modification consists of allowing 5-foot side yard setbacks instead of 5 feet on one side and ten • No opposition. Consent agenda. feet on the other. • The applicant has provided building elevations for Village F(none were provided with the 1999 rezoning).There is no change in the number of units. • AICUZ is 65 to 70. t' rr Jr 4 1,A ins:S, a \C Today Homes,Inc. Today Homes,Inc. 17 i dEverythlnps coming op roses... ... 99.M1R1 .. r Bolero \IILI Io X41° 7,1 �141 y �� o Via°,,,,,,tw ,,, ..,,, ��V i. / JLV..J1 CI . . . Today Homes,Inc. Today Homes,Inc. a ,,stir E..ylh nos cumin, rose._ ; . gh May 27 Items -11,,L in • Timothy and Kimberly Tepper(Street Closure) • Johnathans Cove Homeowners(Use Permit) Ili >ef • T-Mobile Northeast(Use Permit) • nTelos(Use Permit) • New Cingular Wireless/AT&T(Use Permit) • ESI Properties(Modification of Conditions) Today Homes,Inc. 18 Relevant Information R.Timothy Tepper,Jr.and Kimberl W.7'e,.er • Applicants request closure of half of the ...,0%.'AT 1t�•""' unimproved alley behind their property in 01 Croatan so they may incorporate the area •1,,1 0,. rti y into their lot. _` %t t : There have been several street closure �'R" � ,,ti_ ..... requests granted along the subject �a,t A a alleyway within this block during the past ft a.m -' ..,,, 0.-.0- 15 years. A l''''''. vl li �f p p R4O R p_ ,u Viewers met and determined that the a° oos /-A�' proposed closure will not result in a public 4 inconvenience; therefore,they Beach District recommend closure of the right-of-way. ,; ��d OOKING IORTH' ve Evaluation and s ' .40‘ s • Recommendation st'- x_ • Planning Staff recommended approval • ',. ! • Planning Commission recommends ` T „r,,,, �dP�� r 9 , approval (11-0) R'. • No opposition. Consent agenda. 0 N r 4 y , 1 _... - .... _._....-_„ . ,r R.Timothy Tepper,Jr.& berly W,Te Der 19 4.''' 'ill' ,„„',,,, fonathans Cove Homeowners Assoc. i yyy t II ,. �,..,. r w A Or .111.? L "Wilk Wm likeig 1 , 1-1. . { ..1.. Crn»; rcflw.0iii. / ` Kempsville District R Timothy Tepper,Jr &Kimberly W.Tepper Relevant Information Evaluation and • The applicant requests a Conditional Use Permit Recommendation to allow development of the site for a community boat dock for use of the homeowners of the • Planning Staff recommended approval Jonathan's Cove neighborhood. • The community boat dock will provide a means of • Planning Commission recommends temporarily mooring boats,as well as enjoying the water for activities such as crabbing and approval (11-0) fishing for all residents of this community. • No opposition. Consent agenda. • The requested pier is proposed with dimensions of 5'x 60'long.At the end of the pier,a 6'x 16' floating dock is also proposed. • Boat dock area will be gated and locked when not in use. 20 LOOKING NORTH '`t' Elvnbc.th Rivr r R .. ,.41. Wr# •i " e....*. fes. 1jjjjjjjiiIlIIIjJjIiib moi..:: tp • - It r ---vi .i:. a i ,..':' ''-''' . ,.., v5 � s , Jonathans Cove Homeowners Assn. Jonathans Cost Homeowners Assn. T—Mobile Northeast LLC `''' tom w ..y°�� _k t f. �' 1 .. O f. r( C P .�"''f .7 PD-12, I i t 4 .y'�f r tP-n aid ,F �1r-C.(< �{, Q'S. !�/ C ttj.,'° °y' ,,s.4.4.-,�9 ''0,0`Vc\SA• .` `R`'� -,4- 4 ? ' ,. - /. 'l IP 0 1 , e ,Ar ... ....0.1.,.._ Kempsville District JonathansCON eIlomcos5fliers 1ssn. 21 Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Conditional Use Recommendation Permit to construct a 140-foot high monopole communications tower on • Planning Staff recommended approval the subject site. • Planning Commission recommends • Collocation opportunity for two other approval (11-0) users. • No opposition. Consent agenda. • City committee reviewed and found no public facilities or other sites workable as an alternative. • Provisions of Section 232 of the Zoning Ordinance have been met. Y "lir I • 11110., IIWJuj.._. :. as11111110 OM M;tinpoAu rm "'-' T-Mobile\E,LLC 22 �Telo IP II '11; 01.11.11411161eVIA4 Kempsville District T-Mobile NE,LL Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Conditional Use Recommendation Permit to install antennas on an existing 116-foot tall Virginia Power transmission • Planning Staff recommended approval tower. Equipment shelter will be located at • Planning Commission recommends the base of the tower,enclosed with approval (11-0) opaque fencing and landscaping. • No opposition. Consent agenda. • City committee reviewed and found no public facilities or other sites workable as an alternative. • Provisions of Section 232 of the Zoning Ordinance have been met. 23 ——-1 .) W.-- ',..-- ....wasaw. .far 3.,...v.... -91 NORTH, —ow , 1,00KING ,. )117 ' ' , I ( I 1.. t —..'.'°•- , .a., .0..... . I I '1 4, . -1. i.„-!.:: 4,4,1ft t4,,------ ,, I 1 1 J [ _ 1-,--='------:-.....-- v,4,?,0 ---..au.6 CY1.- Ilit, a.el ‘ ‘C, ."- ) , - 6inli) ' a ** Alk 4R.*V :*:04)• ::{1.144' . 4 .4,:,All,„,;,,, I _ Nieto.' ait' Ntelos , . • ' PCS LLC \'''' Cm uk.;* - l' " -.......I.,. IT 7,:si8: -C!f• '"'. .• j 0-1.0-111 i .. ..,<4,_\ \ \vi4:41tj• f A .. . ',15 1 :..,. ,.:1,,.. •c. a 5`. R 75, ,..10et r i r it Ifa q.7;re. CO!.i41;fr 4:;;i1C,44ce\N"V:4',1ktil:, . , _ ..!.. %,.... t.....0.. . 4 ' u °A ..40,11%.,,-• ..440:11kk tr - • 7X111 , titelos Centerville District 24 Relevant Information Evaluation and • Applicant requests a Conditional Use Recommendation Permit to replace an existing Virginia Power lattice-style transmission tower • Planning Staff recommended approval with a monopole transmission tower for the purpose of installingantennas at the • Planning Commission recommends top of the pole(123 feet . approval (11-0) • Equipment cabinet will be located at the base of the tower,enclosed with opaque • No opposition. Consent agenda. fencing and landscaping. • City committee reviewed and found no public facilities or other sites workable as an alternative. • Provisions of Section 232 of the Zoning Ordinance have been met. LOOKING NORTH av i (t= m - CS,LLC t/a AT&T ` �e�r Cingular Wireless PCS,LLC t/a AT&T 25 Relevant Information ur ESI Pro ernes II LLC • Applicant requests a Modification of , ''i �\ r'.it Proffers to allow for an addition to an i ,op . / , M� �� existing building. y7' " r1 �aoriginal r ffers tied the location and 4.Y \\,•� A. r , The proffers \�/ i4�ef x/40 ! size of the building to a proffered site ,l�j' 1"/� //�I ,�' %� plan; thus,to expand the building, a /� /. //i" t,•" modification is needed. V.,:-. t �' �` • Addition consists of an 8,500psquare foot NN •44*" addition of warehouse space; exterior will mss- ., AIV ktt";7 .40kmatch the existing building. �.WP�•m • Adequate parking for the combined floor Rose Hall District area is provided on the site. LO0KING ORTH Evaluation and '0'0 F Recommendation 5 ...tfro r' • Planning Staff recommended approval y; ;,., • Planning Commission recommends �.' •.,r 1 .' tom,' approval (11-0) * / 411100 • No opposition. Consent agenda. 7 *7' t , //t(',1''''f''-; ..?;.',/./-7.1,''4, . :rte@ A . 4 5 or Zi-- . kir ,,,,"'" -_,., x-44-ap 4iiii i s i holm tics,11,11 t 26 4111 miniamplamw' 441"' ' Ti � Ii• '7---"''''-' itn€ ^ f 'KA!'" 1 — 'Kane ...J • .-.wn -- Y is . ESI Properties,II,GLC "` ESI Properties,II,LLC i i 1 i 1 27 1 6 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN 1:23P.M. Mr. Fagan Stackhouse, Director—Human Resources provided the attached presentation, which is attached and made a part of these proceedings, along with the Verbatim Transcript. 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DeSteph At-Large Harry E . Diezel Kempsville - District 2 Robert M. Dyer Centerville - District 1 Barbara M. Henley Princess Anne - District 7 Reba S . McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E . Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L. Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS 2 CITY MANAGER: It ' s my understanding Council would like to get into Compensation at this point; is that correct? I hope it is . Fagan is here . We ' re ready to roll . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : I believe everyone has a copy. Good afternoon, Madam Mayor . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Good afternoon. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Members of City Council . This afternoon, I ' d like to spend some time talking about Compensation, and that will be followed by Healthcare, kind of a follow-up conversation regarding the earlier presentation on Healthcare . Whenever we bring up the topic of Compensation, it generates a lot of interest . We have the Workforce, obviously, that ' s always excited about what ' s going to be done in Compensation. And certainly, as Council, you have a concern, and obviously the taxpayers , and rightfully so, because 48 . 4% makes up the Operating Budget . So, what I ' d like to do, first of all, is focus around several areas and starting with kind of an Overview of Personnel Costs, and then that sort of sets the context of the foundation for the Proposed Components to the Compensation Plan that I ' d like to talk about this afternoon . The General Increase approach that we ' re taking, the Exceptional Performance Bonus Award Program, which is something new that we would like to offer during these challenging fiscal times , and then the Use Funds for Hard-to-Fill Positions . I ' ll have to define and describe what that means a little bit later on and then sort of wrap up with some summary comments about these things that we ' ve talked about . And looking at the overall Personnel Costs, the personnel costs for the upcoming Fiscal Year shows a $4 . 5 million increase; that ' s a pretty small sliver, about 1 . 04% increase . And when you look at the budget that we ' re proposing for Personnel Costs , $437 . 9 million, including the Internal Services Funds for Fiscal Year 09 versus the $433 . 4 million. So, you get that $4 . 5 million, but these increases are primarily due to the salary costs . And also, you can look at the rollover, and normally there ' s some rollover that occurs each year; that ' s included, as well, and the General Increase for the upcoming year . Now, the good news about this chart is that we ' ve got a couple of reductions . We have reductions in the Retirement because 3 of some pretty good investments there at VRS . That ' s going down from $50 . 9 million to $48 million, so that ' s a reduction of $2 . 9 million. We also have a reduction in life insurance; currently at $2 . 9 million and it ' s going down to $2 . 6 million, and so that ' s a savings of about $300 , 000 , around $319 , 000 . So, those funds , already, those dollars are being redirected for other needs . But I just wanted to give you kind of a little bit of a context of what it looks like and then I ' d like to kind of roll right into the Proposed Compensation Program. Now, you ' ll see right off the bat that it ' s $500 -- I 'm sorry, $5 . 8 million that ' s been allocated to this proposed Compensation Program for the coming year . You have to keep in mind, I just said that we ' re only showing an increase of 4 1/2 , but then you back out the VRS and back out the life insurance, then it ' s going to come back down, so it ' s a matter of how you compare that . Now, looking at the funding, specifically, we are looking at $3 . 9 million for the General Increase, and I 'm going to go into more detail and talk about these more specifically in just a few minutes . And then there ' s the $1 million that we ' re setting aside for what we ' re calling the Exceptional Performance Bonus Awards Program. And then we have the hard-to-fill positions ; we ' re setting aside about $900 , 000 there . Taking a look at the General Increase and what that really provides , it will be obvious and apparent on its face, but there are a few things in here that I want to kind of walk through with you. If you step back for a couple of years, we started providing General Increases in the last couple of years, ' 06- ' 07 , and of course this year, ' 07- ' 08 , and we provided 1 . 5 for both of those years , and we also provided 2% Merit for each of those years . General Increase really moves the individuals ' salaries . It ' s a real healthy thing to do for a Pay Plan, and it also moves the minimums and the maximums . So, you can think of it this way, everything is shifting upward by 1 . 5% . We also are doing that for our hourly workers so they don ' t get too far behind and so that they are competitive . And we have a number of hourly workers , so we ' re applying that to the hourly scales . Now, for our Public Safety employees , which includes Police, these are the sworn folks , Fire, EMS, and the Sheriff ' s Office, we are not providing this 1 . 5% General Increase . In lieu of that, they are getting the increased multiplier, that started on January, and that ' s going up from 1 . 7 to 1 . 85 . And so, there will be that difference for the Public Safety employees, but you can always kind of keep in mind that this increased multiplier is going to increase their benefit by 9% . 4 VICE-MAYOR JONES : By how much? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : By 9% . So, that ' s, I think, a pretty good benefit addition. Now, what will happen then the following year would be that they would receive along with all of the other employees 1 . 5% General Increase . In other words , they wouldn ' t get it July 1 of 2008 , but they would receive the 1 . 5% increase July 1 of 2009 . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: What about the final compression adjustment? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : We completed the final compression adjustment for those two years based on what we had set out to do, and we would be looking back in on it about every three years . We realize that some compression would occur as a result of people being promoted, especially persons who stayed down in the ranks for many, many, years, and the younger people that are promoted and fast risers into these high ranks, so we ' ve got several examples of that happening. Someone says , "Well , I like my life the way it is right now, so I 'm not going to put in and work for the promotion. " But then -- COUNCILMAN WOOD: I 'm sorry, maybe I 'm asking the wrong question. I thought we had one more year of compression. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : No, sir . We ' ve got two years ' worth of compression adjustments, and we ' re into the last year right now, so that ' s happening. COUNCILMAN WOOD: So, that goes through July? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : That ' s correct -- it goes through June 30th. COUNCILMAN WOOD: Well , you have July 1st . Okay. CITY MANAGER: We did both horizontal and vertical, if you recall . COUNCILMAN WOOD: For some reason, I thought there was one more . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: There is a third leg to that, I believe, and it starts at pay plan 5 that has not been negotiated and/or approved, and this Council hasn ' t seen it yet, but that ' s the third leg of what Jim is talking about . I 'm kind of curious, the original estimates and the amount of money this Council authorized to address the compression issue turned out to be much higher than the actual cost, I believe . I think we set aside $12 million, and we have not spent anything like that, have we? FAGAN STACKHOUSE: I ' ll get those numbers for you, but I believe we were slightly under the amount based on the resolution. I think we spent about $3 . 6 million on Public Safety for each year . One year was slightly less than the other, but basically around $7 . 1-$7 . 2 million. SUSAN WALSTON: There was 4 . 5 allotted each year . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Right, 4 . 5 allotted each year, but we spent under that amount . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood, then Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I need to finish my question. MAYOR OBERNDORF: I 'm sorry, Mr . Diezel . Please, finish your question. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: And rather than get this in a protracted, I ' ll just pass, there ' s some questions I need to get back with Fagan on, in terms of the amount of money that was authorized versus that that was allotted, because it was my understanding, like Jim, that the third leg should have been in that original estimate . CITY MANAGER: Well, we can talk about this , maybe we have more time, but as you go through and literally adjust for every single position, when we finally went through it with the methodology that everybody had signed off on, in terms of the employee groups, it actually came out slightly less, but it wasn ' t in terms of changing the philosophy or addressing the issue; just as you did those individual position by position by position computations, it came out a little bit less than we had estimated. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I didn ' t hear any complaints on that at all , Jim. That wasn ' t the issue . There ' s a third-leg issue and what is the cost of that third-leg issue, in terms of the balance and/or future appropriations . 6 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Yes, and I am aware of the third leg that Harry is talking about, but I had actually thought there was a third year, as well as the third leg. But what Harry brings up is a very good point, when we talk about the structured pay plan we ' re told that it couldn ' t be implemented because we had to do the new payroll system and then it seems like, and you might not be the right person, it might be ComIT, I don ' t know, but it looks like the latest thing that we have is the payroll system is delayed again? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Dave Hansen would probably be the person to ask on that . Susie could refer to that . CITY MANAGER: That ' s correct, we ' re looking at January 1, ' 09 . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Yes . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Yes . So, that ' s like a year and a half overdue? CITY MANAGER: Correct . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: And how much is that in cost, because we got that report last week, the cost of delaying it that we ' re going to have? CITY MANAGER: Dave, do you remember what that number was? DAVID HANSEN: Council, in Friday' s packet, we provided you an update . We conducted our parallel testing, meaning that we took a look at the new Oracle software and compared it to our current Legacy system. We have some more refinement to do, and we have decided to delay going live until 1 January 2009 ; that is because we need to do it on a quarterly basis, we need to reduce all the risks that we can so that we can make that when we do convert we have eliminated the possibility of screwing up people ' s pay. We will not be doing biweekly and we will not be doing in arrears until we 've operated in a live status under Oracle for two quarters post that . From a financing perspective, we have eliminated a tier of consultants . They ' re in the process of being, their work is being, consolidated, and we are looking at how internal staff, 7 as well as the remaining consultants , can perform the rest of the testing that we need to do and then be prepared to adopt our live system on 1 January. No additional financing is requested in the budget for that, other than the fact that we ' re going to implement Phase II of that , which are some additional modules at the very end of the Fiscal Year going into FY 2010 . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: I just still didn ' t get an answer . Why is it taking so long? DAVID HANSEN: Because we have so many additional items to add, our leave, our special modules that different offices, specifically Public Safety, with ancillary officers, and concealed weapons , and some other data tracking that they want to do have not been incorporated into that . You add that to making that conversion on a quarterly basis , because of the reconciliation necessary and the fact that we are facing our year-end closeout end of June/July and then Open Enrollment with Healthcare on 1 October, it was thought that the most convenient time and providing enough time for the testing to eliminate and work through line by line, payroll by payroll, employee by employee, the reconciliation it takes -- COUNCILMAN WOOD: What do you mean by "concealed weapons" ? What does that have to do with payroll? DAVID HANSEN: We do inside the payroll system, it ' s HR/Payroll ; remember, it ' s not only just payroll , it ' s HR accountability, as well . And so, there is tracking inside the Oracle Payroll System that you can put manpower, uniforms , personnel accountability, and all the aspects of managing our employees inside this HR/Payroll System. And those modules are in the Oracle system and are being moved over from our Legacy. COUNCILMAN WOOD: What does that have to do with a concealed weapons permit; that has nothing to do with payroll? DAVID HANSEN: It ' s a tracking system of HR. It ' s a module inside of it . It ' s one of the many applications , modules, that are inside the software program that we are adapting. COUNCILMAN WOOD: Maybe I 'm asking the wrong question 8 here. I guess, fundamentally, my question is, we were told, and this has been going on since 2002-2003 time frame when we talked about a structured pay plan and fixing this compression, and all along the reason was we can ' t go to a structured pay plan because of the Legacy system. And there ' s one person in the entire organization who can actually work on the Legacy system right now, and that ' s -- DAVID HANSEN: And that person is going to retire in December . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Yes , well, see, which is another issue there . And I guess my question is, is all along we ' ve known exactly what has to be done, the number of employees hasn ' t appreciably changed from 2002 to today, the Court business of the City hasn ' t changed appreciably in that time period, and still we ' re at least 18 months behind schedule on this, and I 'm trying to figure out why we ' re behind schedule . I don ' t understand. DAVID HANSEN: We ' ll be about a year behind schedule, Mr . Wood, and most conversions to major enterprise systems rarely come in on time because of the difficulties of converting business processes into the software application, and we are going through that process with our Legacy system. We have dedicated tremendous amounts of manpower, both from the subject matter experts in HR, as well as our payroll and our finance team, as well as the consultants that Oracle provides to help us do that . And converting from the Legacy system to a major enterprise software program, it takes time, and there must be a reduction in risk so that when we do throw the switch we are able to produce the payroll of a 7 , 000-person organization accurately. COUNCILMAN WOOD: Okay. And, Madam Mayor, if I could? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Please? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Explain to me, then, the correlation between a citizen buying a concealed weapons permit and this, because you -- DAVID HANSEN: I will provide you a list of all the additional HR, not Payroll, HR modules that go along with our accountability inside our current HR system that is also converting along with Payroll ; that ' s why you have both Fagan ' s team, as well as Patti ' s team, working on bringing in the conversion aspects, abstracting from our current databases, and converting it into 9 an Oracle database and being able to produce the recordation, the reports, the multiple reports that we use in payroll , as well as our personnel system to manage our organization. SUSAN WALSTON: The concealed weapons that ' s currently in an HR System now, just to get clarification, those weapons are of sworn officers, not citizen concealed weapons . COUNCILMAN WOOD: All right . That was my question, the concealed weapons permit . SUSAN WALSTON: It ' s part of the Police Department database . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Yes , well, that answers the question. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Does the organization that sold you the system not come in to help you make the transition of your information and the like so that there is not such a -- DAVID HANSEN: Absolutely. MAYOR OBERNDORF: How much has this cost to purchase? DAVID HANSEN: Total system, I ' ll provide you an update on that . I mean, I don ' t know how much we ' ve expended out of the total appropriation. I ' ll provide you an update. I don ' t have it readily available. I know Gwen is coming in next week providing a ComIT brief . One of her points that she ' ll be presenting is where we ' re at in the expenditure of the current appropriation. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. I just, and I admit, I have never done a system like this, but it would seem if someone were talking a customer into buying it and they said it should only take "X" amount of time to get it up and running that they would make -- they never make that commitment? So, I guess I 'm wondering why they don ' t have someone that they can help train our staff to know how to get the information online within, how long have we been at this now, a year or more? DAVID HANSEN: About two years since we started the actual consultants on board and started looking at our Legacy data and mapping our business processes, which takes nearly a year to do that . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood wants to follow up . I 10 guess, if this were private industry and you had payroll that had to go out, as well as the medical things , somehow I have a feeling they would make the transition much more expeditiously so that they wouldn ' t constantly be in a state of disarray and trying to get it accomplished. DAVID HANSEN: Well, I would say we ' re not in a state of disarray. I would say that we know exactly where we are, that our payroll is not in jeopardy, that we continue to pay our workforce appropriately and accurately. I would say that we are reducing the risk that we will face when and if we turn that switch on, then we expect there will be some, if you will, electrons flying around, that one or two, three or four, folks inside the workforce will probably have to have a reconciliation of their payroll , but we ' re hoping with 99 . 9% accuracy when we flip that switch we have an accurate payroll . And I think when you go from a fairly antiquated homemade system that we currently have into a local enterprise system, the adaptability of what we have locally here in Virginia Beach to an international firm that will provide us regular version updates on an annual basis and keep our data secure is worth the effort that we ' re spending . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Have the Schools taken on this Oracle and made the transition? DAVID HANSEN: I 'm glad you asked that . The Schools did not take on Oracle . They took on another system, and they delivered their system 16-18 months late beyond their projected. A salesman pitch said that ' s when they ' re going to go live, because when you get into the process of converting what you do into program code and then into output in the form of reports it is a very involved and complex scenario . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: Well, I guess , I ' ll talk about it later . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I actually have one comment and a few questions, and, one, Dave, if you can stay up there, and the rest are pretty much for Fagan. If this were private industry incorporating an enterprise system or solution, which I 've gone through, and I 'm sure Ron has 11 gone through -- COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I have, too . I 'm doing it now, two years -- COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: -- in some larger environments there ' s actual considerable consequences for missing your deadlines and reports , and that ' s built into the contract up front . But, with that stated, the questions are more concerns that I had with this , and one of the things, Dave, you said that kind of shocked me, because I thought we went through this and decided not to do it, was payment in arrears . I thought we discussed already that we would not go implement an arrears payment schedule with this . DAVID HANSEN: Right . We ' re not . We ' re going live without it . We ' ll operate two years -- two quarters in it , and then we ' ll contemplate whether or not we involve, incorporate, arrears, which from a GASB standpoint and our SAS-12 current accounting standards articles, our design, internal controls that provide rather than current time into an arrears process to reduce the amount of errors that we are currently having. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. Because I thought we made the decision last year, maybe 18 months ago, that we would not do that because of the effect it would have on our, I guess, more junior staff . DAVID HANSEN: Correct, and that ' s why we ' re not doing it on 1 January when we do go live . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I thought the decision we made was we wouldn ' t do it, period, but I guess maybe that didn ' t happen. DAVID HANSEN: I 'm not operating under that . I 'm operating it under as it was too difficult to do when you convert . We need to have victory in the fact that when you do convert the payroll is accurate and then we ' ll decide how the process would move towards a bi-weekly in arrears processing, and we ' ll be back to brief down the road on the impacts . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: That ' s a philosophical decision that I hope gets back to this Council first, because I 'm sure we have folks who live paycheck to paycheck and this would actually impact them. 12 DAVID HANSEN: Absolutely. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, with that being said, I ' ll continue with the other questions, which are back to Fagan. If we could, you had said that the 1 . 5% General Increase, the Law Enforcement or Public Safety employees will not get that ; in lieu, they' ll get the increased multiplier, but you said that it would be, you said something that alluded to the fact that it would be, a 9% increase in their compensation? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : A 9% increase, in terms of the benefit whenever they do retire and receive the benefit . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, way, way, out years . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Yes . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. The way it was stated, it sounded like it was a 9% increase today, which I couldn ' t figure out how. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : No, I may have misspoke on that . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: We already hit the compression issue and I understand where Jim and Harry were talking about the third with the piece there . Back to the slide that I think was before this, can you kind of explain what the $900, 000 is used for in the hard-to-fill positions, kind of what the criteria is for that? And then the same with the exceptional performance bonus, how does it work; what ' s the criteria for that? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : If I could go through a few more slides? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, we ' re going to get to that? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Correct . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I ' ll hold my questions on that . Thank you, Madam Mayor . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Other questions up to this point? 13 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Anyone else have any other questions up to this point? COUNCILMAN WOOD: I have one more payroll question I have to ask. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: In 2007 , ComIT, and Mrs . Walston and Mr. Stackhouse were nice enough to give me this information, spent 31 , 000 hours of overtime, $626, 000; was a lot of that related to this? FAGAN STACKHOUSE: I couldn ' t answer that specifically. COUNCILMAN WOOD: I mean, that just seems like a heck of a lot . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : We can get with the department and have them provide it . CITY MANAGER: We ' ll get you the answer for that, Jim. COUNCILMAN WOOD: I asked for it last week and I still haven ' t gotten it . DAVID HANSEN: The lion ' s share for ComIT ' s overtime is in 911, and we ' re doing a divisional breakdown of which, application support, program support, telephone support, as well as 911 , that ' s producing that, and we ' re doing that for all of those. I think ComIT is the sixth largest user of overtime in the City, if you look, and we ' re doing some other analysis, Jim. We ' re looking at cost per hour and where that ' s all being done . We need to do it for Public Works . We need to do it for Police . We need to have a total assessment . We understand what you ' ve asked for . It ' s just taking some time to get that produced back for you. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. Villanueva? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I just want to go back to the Oracle situation on enterprise conversion. Those things do take quite some time . Like Bill was saying, my company right now is in its second year of going through the conversion, and we ' re pretty familiar with Oracle and it ' s just once you get into it you 've got to cater towards your organization and then at that same sense, while your staff is getting the training, you ' ve got to make sure you maintain that you ' re not actually incorporating more consulting hours , 14 because it ' s a very complex system. But I think with Dave and his team, what they need to do is articulate clear milestones on these things and update staff and Council on when we ' re going to meet these things, because it ' s true, it ' s very complex, these conversions, but at that same sense we ' ve got to articulate are we meeting this ; if not, then we 've got to go back to the contractor who ' s delivering the enterprise system and saying "hey, you ' re not meeting it" . Again, I invite you all to come over to my office and you can see an Oracle conversion go . I mean, we 've got full-time staff and we 've got consultants, and it ' s just incredible . You can ' t comprehend what it takes, but it ' s incredible . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: This has been going on probably since about 1997 , because it was initially the Schools and the City doing it together, and the Schools went first because their system was much more antiquated. I mean, they were doing all of their stuff on little bitty cards, and it took two years to get them straight, and then the City started down their path. It ' s been going on forever . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. Forgive us . We ' re back on track. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : I think it ' s all very important information. If we could then go to the next slide and talk about the exceptional performance bonus award, this is very new for us . And so, what we are looking at here is taking a current system and doing something slightly different with it the first year . So, the first thing you have to recognize is that with a bonus we ' re not going to add this to the base of the employees ' salary. This is a one-time deal based on the employee performing at an outstanding level . In other words, we are setting a threshold of up to 20% of the employees . We only have a million dollars here, so 20% of the employees can receive this bonus if they are performing at an outstanding or an exceptional level . We haven ' t defined all of what that means yet, but we want to get it right . I ' ve talked with the Department Directors on two occasions and gotten some feedback from them on how best we can do this . We would be using ratings . We ' ll be using weights . We ' ll be using numerical values and creating preambles of performance at some point, but for this first year we would take the existing system and tie a quantifiable rating scale to it . 15 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: How is this different from the Manager/Management or Peer Bonuses of the past budgets? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : The Peer Award is where, and when we put this together years ago we didn ' t think it would work and didn' t think it would work well at all , but it ' s where peers will make a nomination to a committee of employees and they would decide whether or not this nomination would be worthy of recognition, and they are really tough. They don ' t give out very many of those at all , but it ' s a recognition of $500 or $250, saying that this person really went beyond their job to do something that was truly outstanding . So, it ' s a one-time, kind of initial effort, and that ' s the difference between this . This will be tied to the overall performance; in other words , how did you perform all of your goals and objectives, and the whole rating system would be tied specifically to that . We really wanted to demonstrate and we ' ll have to go out and train all the employees, let them know that this is really what we are doing very, very, different . Thirteen years ago, we had a system that was tied to performance levels , and without going to a lot of explanation around that , it didn ' t work anywhere near as well as we had hoped it would, but we ' re going back to it now. We know a lot more now than we did then, and we really want to get all 600 or so of our managers and leaders into the classrooms to teach them how to write effective goals and objectives and then follow through in that regard. We think that it will work. Many, Many, places have tried pay for performance or, in this case, we ' re talking, before we get there, to that, and we want to go there in about 2010 . I 'm going to talk about that a little bit later, but we wanted to start someplace . This is a place to start . When the Fiscal challenge is upon us , we ' re trying our best to give something to those well-deserving employees , and all of the other employees are going to be watching how this goes . So, we want to make sure that we do it well and do it right and then we can substantiate, each department director is going to be responsible for substantiating and signing off on any bonus that is given, based on an overall one-year performance . I hope that helped some . CITY MANAGER: Let me jump in here . This is in response, really, to one of the, I 16 think, one of the principle recommendations of the Blue Ribbon Task Force; it was that the Merit System, as it has been practiced, is simply not working. A number of you have expressed that, that 96% of the employees get the same merit increase; it ' s pretty hard to call it merit, if that ' s your definition of merit that 96% of the folks get it . So, this is an effort to take a very limited amount of money that we 've got this coming year and begin to move in that direction to recognize those that are really doing an exceptional job, which I think that ' s where the Blue Ribbon Task Force was going . You can better use your money if you really reward those that are really producing. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: What was it called when we did it before? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I think it was a Manager ' s or Management -- COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: No . FAGAN STACKHOUSE: Behavioral Anchored Rating Scales, we called BARS, and we had 2 . 5 , 5 , and 7 . 5 ; 97% received the 5% , very few in a bell-shaped curve at 2 . 5 , and then 7 . 5 . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I understand how the Peer worked in the past , and I personally believe a bonus is just that; it is for performance above and beyond. And when you say you shouldn ' t pay for performance, I think you do that every day when you pay somebody' s salary. But in the past , we had a Manager or Manager ' s , Management, something like that, bonus program, and we went through the Compensation Task Force with it before, which seems like it was exactly what we ' re seeing here . So, I 'm trying to distinguish them apart . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : The current performance appraisal system, we have a current bonus system, but we ' re going to suspend that bonus system in lieu of the system that we ' re putting in place . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, all of the other bonus -- FAGAN STACKHOUSE : No, not all . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: -- initiatives? Well then, how -- 17 FAGAN STACKHOUSE: Let me explain that . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Let ' s do this . Instead of trying to get into this , what bonuses do we have for employees for doing a good job? Because when we went through this last time, I spent three months digging into this, and every time we got two of them, one went away and another came back, and then we finally came with a huge list of all these; what are the bonuses that employees can get based on City manager, based on Peer, based on whatever, all things out there? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : The City Manager ' s award program went away many, many, years ago, so that one you can' t put to the side . We have the Peer Award, which is given by peers . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, we still have a Peer Award. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Yes , yes , and that is a very good program. We think it works very, very, effectively. We think it works very, very, effectively. It probably costs the City less than $50, 000 a year . Then we have what ' s called the Performance Bonus Award -- I 'm sorry, Performance Bonus Program. In that, we have what ' s called a Premium Experience Bonus , a Signing Bonus . These are the signing bonuses where if you go out and you recruit a Police Officer, if they make it through 15 months of rigorous training and they are successful, then the officer gets a certain amount of dollars; I think it ' s $500 . Also, if someone does an exceptionally, really good job at something specific, then that ' s called like an achievement, and we provide bonuses . Those are reviewed very stringently by the Department Directors, by the Director of Human Resources, and by the City Manager ' s Office . I think basically that ' s about all that we have . If there ' s one that I 'm missing, Regina? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, then we have a Peer Award Bonus Program, which we ' ve had in the past . We have a Performance Bonus Program, a Signing Bonus Program, and an Achievement Bonus Program, which are all completely different than the Exceptional Performance one . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : The achievement piece we ' re going to drop off, because it ' s very close to what we are proposing, but it wasn ' t done based on a complete evaluation in a fairer determination and review of everybody in the department and who should get what at that point . 18 These were based on the specific acts that people did. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, the Achievement Bonus is not in this year ' s budget, or it is in this year ' s budget? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : It ' s not . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. The Signing Bonuses are or are not? FAGAN STACKHOUSE: We want to keep those, if this is the Council ' s wish, because that will help us sometimes in attracting people . If there ' s something that ' s needed that is going to make the deal or break the deal, sometimes we can say "we will help you with this " , or if you have this particular skill and you pay for it out of your pocket and you ' re going to leave this organization to bring it here, we 've actually done that in our ComIT Department, we ' ll pay for that, we ' ll pay that expense off for you if you will come and work for us, because we really need your skills here . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I understand what it ' s used for, but is it currently in the budget that has been presented? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Yes . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, it ' s currently in there . The Performance Bonus Program, that ' s currently in this year ' s budget, as presented to us so far, correct? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : So far . That is the $1 million. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. And is that the same as this? FAGAN STACKHOUSE: No. I 'm not sure what -- CITY MANAGER: What he ' s talking about is funded out of the Departmental vacancy savings, and if funding is available those are made available . This program is replacing that program. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. I 'm trying to just see what ' s in today ' s budget and how it ' s different than the two things that were shown here, and we 've come to that the Achievement Bonuses are no longer in there, so that ' s not in the budget . 19 FAGAN STACKHOUSE: That ' s correct . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: But we have Signing Bonuses, Performance Bonus Program, and Peer Award Bonuses that are currently in this year ' s budget . My next question is, we have $900 , 000 to use for the hard-to-fill positions; what criteria is that and then how is that different from Signing Bonuses? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Because Signing Bonuses would play a part for the hard-to-fill . If I can skip over a couple of slides to get to the hard-to-fill? If we need to go back to a slide, then we can. The hard-to-fill , and I think everybody knows what ' s happening in, like, the nursing industry, we have positions where we have very challenging situations trying to get nurses into certain jobs . In addition to that, we have psychiatrists, engineers is becoming problematic; we are not holding on to some of our best engineers . We ' re holding on to a lot of our good engineers . I want to make sure that ' s clear . But in addition to that, there are IT positions that are hard to fill . So, we felt at this point in time, given the tight economy, people are not just walking out and saying " I 'm going to jump ship and go to the greener pastures that are much lusher and greener" , because they think "okay, it may not be as green on the other side, I 'm going to sit tight until this economy kind of does one thing or another" . Then we have the generation of differences, as new youngsters come into the organization; there ' s a lot that ' s going on there, too. They want things different . They ' re not with the old City Governmental cookie-cutter approach. They say, "This is kind of how I ' d like to see things done . I ' d like my benefits this way. " And they ' re not as loyal , so they may stay for a little while and they ' re off and they ' re doing something else . We 've seen many of those occur . And then to get to the point, the private sector can offer some stiff competition. If they really want someone, and I just had a wonderful opportunity, but there ' s no way that I could have gotten this individual into this organization with our current salary structure, they will put up the competition, they will absolutely come in with bonuses, and they will do things with various leave programs because they own their own companies and they can do all of these things . We don ' t have that flexibility with public funds . So, with the hard-to-fill criteria, here ' s what we are 20 considering it to be . Two consecutive unsuccessful recruitment efforts, and sometimes these get expensive, so that would be an indicator that either there are no real well-qualified people, then maybe this position ought to be deemed hard to fill , or unsuccessful in hiring even above the minimum. Normally, we bring people at the minimums of salary, salary range, and sometimes we will hire above the minimum and then that ' s something that I will do, or if it ' s high enough up in the range over 20% then Jim Spore would have to authorize it because we take it very seriously. And if we can ' t yield a person with that, then that ' s when we give the Signing Bonus . You see, these programs kind of dovetail each other. So, the Signing Bonus might be a person that said "well, I ' ll come to work here, but I 'm making $55 , 000 . " And we say, "Well , the farthest we can go is $50 , 000 . " Okay. "Well, we ' ll give you $3 , 000 as a bonus ; that goes away after one year . " That has brought in several people . We would like to keep that, but if we can ' t even lure them with that, then we say something else is wrong . We 've got to do some other kinds of things in order to bring them in. So, we start asking the questions of the competitive, and just one more slide here to give some focus of this hard to fill . Are the positions competitive with the Five-City market? In other words, we all know what those five cities are, Norfolk, Newport News, Hampton, Chesapeake, and Portsmouth. It may be we have some positions right now that are driving, there ' s another market that is driving, some of our engineers . We 've got to get a handle on that . We 've lost, I think, 13 engineers in the last 18 months, and they were well qualified and holding very responsible positions here . Is a changed pay range needed? Do we need to change the pay range, or maybe we don ' t need to change the salary? Sometimes an incentive, we brought a well-qualified person in saying, " I ' ve had for years at least a week or two of leave . Can we work that out?" We can work out those kinds of situations . So, all of those things are what we ' re trying to do with the hard to fill with the $900 , 000 . We don ' t have a market , we ' re putting a market in place right now, so, therefore, we need something else to make sure that if we need to in this tight economy to move the pay range based on what we see the demand is and why we can ' t fill positions that are difficult to fill . CITY MANAGER: That ' s the key point, if I could just amplify that . I think, if you recall , last year we decided not to implement the Market Salary Survey. That ' s causing problems . That was $2 . 7 million to do that . We tried to come up with an idea that 21 would cost 1/3 of that amount, $900 , 000 , and use it to target very selectively those positions that we ' re either losing people to other organizations, both public and private, or we simply can ' t hire people in at the rates that we ' re paying . So, we ' re trying to be more cost effective with that than with the previous Market Salary Survey, which you can only do that for so many years and we ' re going to be digging ourselves into a hole . This is an attempt to address the personnel needs of the organization, both in terms of retention and recruitment, in a way that ' s much more cost effective than the Market Salary Survey. That survey, which was conducted in the fall of ' 06 for implementation in ' 07 , that was deferred and really needs to be updated, and I think we would propose that we update that survey again to see where we are, particularly as some of these departures in the organization continue . But this effort, in terms of the hard to fill , is to try and rather than give adjustments to several hundred positions in the organization is to focus that in where we ' re really having critical needs . And we ' ve asked each of the Department Directors to give us a list of "where are you having trouble keeping or hiring people" , and we 've got that list, and it ' s a much smaller list than the Market Salary Survey implementation. So, that will save you about $1 . 8 million by doing this, as opposed to the Market Salary Survey. We ' d much rather do the Market Salary Survey; we just don' t think we can afford it . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Any other questions? Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I just have one follow-up, and I ' ll use engineers just for ease of use . In private industry and Federal Government and other organizations, they go to the colleges to recruit early with co-op programs and things like that for engineers, and they expect a specific level of turnover at the upper levels, middle levels, and lower levels, and they make sure they get out there and recruit early. So, I 'm going to hold the rest of my questions , put them all in writing, because we ' re going in circles and I 'm getting frustrated. So, I ' ll put everything else in writing on the subject and just stop. FAGAN STACKHOUSE: Okay. When we talked about the hard to fill, we talked about Exceptional Performance Bonus, and if your questions are around that we will be certainly happy to try and answer those . And incidentally, I do have the Compensation Manager, Regina Hilliard, here, and on the whole Performance Management, 22 Performance Appraisal Program, Debbie Spencer, Employee Relations, who manages that one. Taking a look, I would call it Slide 10, this is kind of in a summary format, what we have here is the goal that we have of 4 . 5%; I think we all remember that we had a goal of 4 . 5% Merit each year . And the reason that we set the 4 . 5 is that we have a 4-5% pay range spread for most of our employees, so we said in ten years, theoretically, you could reach the top . Well , we were not successful in doing that every year . Now, we ' ve had this program since 1995 , thirteen years , and we were able, and we did a pretty good job, nine of those thirteen years we were able to get the 4 . 5 , but the other four we were not successful . And, of course, as of late, we 've sort of trailed down, as you can see some of the numbers , kind of following that orange bar where Virginia Beach is representative there and the other cities . And, of course, we propose for the next two years we would not be anywhere near that, and we ' re not proposing that we would be there . We are probably going to move from what we call, Mayor, to a performance increase that ' s tied to the performance levels and so forth over time . But I wanted to kind of give you a little bit of an overview, in terms of where we are, how we are positioned in the market today with the other cities that are in our local market . In addition to that, how we are maximizing these limited resources, the $1 . 9 million, $1 million for the Exceptional Performance Bonus Award and the $900, 000 for the Hard-to-Fill, we are doing what we hope to be something of a creative approach, and so that ' s what we ' re trying to do is to demonstrate how we can best do that . Now, one caution here is that as we move forward what you won ' t see in this proposal is any movement across the ranges . The Merits allowed us to move across the ranges , or a performance increase would allow you to move people across their pay range . When they don ' t move across the pay range, there will be some minor compression. To give you an example, you have a Master Fire Fighter, this year, April 15th, gets hired. Next year, April 15th, 2009 , another Fire Fighter, another hired Fire Fighter, Master Fire Fighter level is just an example, those two people could potentially end up with the same salary, one hired a year later . It could also happen with promotions . You have a Master Fire Fighter who gets promoted to the Captain level, next level up, this year today. Next year, there ' s another one that gets promoted to the Captain level, and normally they ' re going to be fairly close to the beginning of the range, those two could potentially compress upon one 23 another. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Hold it . That ' s a bad example, in my mind, because an Ordinance says if you get promoted from Step 1 to Step 2 , there ' s a 10% deferential . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Even with the 10%, they could still be fairly close to compression. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Now, you ' re hitting on the elements that Public Safety were talking about, in terms of a structured process . If we ' re not going to recognize seniority and the value to it in terms of that pay scale, we ought to tell the employees that . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : There are a lot of elements to the example I gave, now. Some person could be further on. They could make more when they get promoted. This is just a basic example . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Having been through the Behavior Anchored Rating System, and Barbara asked what it was , a Federal Judge told me it was a spoil system, and the more I thought about it the more I agree . That 20% that you ' re talking about in terms of the departments by numbers seems to me to be counterproductive to the concept of teamwork. I have a real problem with that . I 'm not going to be very supportive of it unless I see very clear, objective, measuring standards that the employees, themselves, can see . The subjectivity of most of the personnel evaluation systems just kills it, particularly when it ' s in the hands of the Supervisor first . I have a couple of questions that I ' d like to pose to you . What would happen if we gave the employees a 3% pay raise in December, as opposed to what ' s being proposed here in July? That would seem to be no increase in existing funding, as presented by this particular budget; am I correct in that? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Basically, it would be about the same amount of money. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: The rollover process the following year, you have a 3% impact . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Right, if you put it in the form of what we call performance increases or merit, you would have that rollover . You would also have it, too, if you just gave it as a general increase . 24 COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Now, that wouldn ' t increase anybody coming across the scale. It just says that at Scale 1 you ' re now 3% higher today. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : That ' s right . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I ' d probably be in a position to do that in terms of disposable income for these employees and the impact on the Operating Budget , and I think we ' ll all see that . I 'm going to ask you to take a look at that, Fagan, and I ' ll probably have some more discussions on it because to me that ' s a more equitable way to treat this employee workforce . They are going to be impacted by the same cost of goods and services that the average citizen is . It ' s in line with what we see happening in the private sector, as well, at the moment . Plus, the fact our No-Layoff Program is an attrition program, that if you lose 200 employees a year through normal attrition and you attach a given dollar value to it , what you ' re looking at is anywhere from $6-$8 million a year in savings . So, in terms of not increasing the budget but maintaining within a given parameter, it would seem that we have a number of options there that we 've not looked at, and I ' ll make that recommendation to the Council here later on in the Formal Session. I 'm not real happy with what I see here at all . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, how do you make, I mean, is then "Merit Pay" a misnomer, because somebody has to judge that somebody deserves merit? So, is it just not possible to give merit or pay for performance; we just always give general increases? Because if you ' re saying, I mean, somebody has to be the judge that somebody is doing an outstanding job and deserves a pay increase, but if we ' re saying that nobody can do that fairly, then we ' re stuck with only always giving general increases . Am I missing something? FAGAN STACKHOUSE: We are hoping that this approach that we ' re taking by going back, revising our performance appraisal program in total over a couple, two or three, years , we can then get at the business of trying to do this as fair and as correct as possible . Mrs . Henley, you are right in that it is a challenge . It ' s a challenge, for example, the Federal Government tried it mid-70 ' s, late-70 ' s, didn ' t do a very good job. Lot of busy work. Lot of paper . They' re trying it again. 25 Many out there, and I know a lot of HR Systems around the country, they 've really tried hard at this in Union environments, non-Union environments, where there ' s collective bargaining in most states . It can be done . There are some success stories, but it has to require the cooperation. I think we will have that with the Department Directors here and their Supervisors down through the organization and the belief that employees see value in it . And we had a meeting the other day and Jim got an informal poll from some of the employees, and they ' d like to see this system work but it has to be done with a hand that people can see that ' s transparent and it ' s not always the favorite children, so to speak, that in fact get the highest awards . We want to get out of this system. COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Fagan, Barbara has hit on the fundamental point from the employees ' side of it . You have a range that you hire folks from A-Z , and that range can be 20% or 30% , in terms of the initial salary or the ending salary, based upon that . All the employees are saying to us is "how do we use that range to come across " ? That ' s a seniority mechanism or it has been in the Federal Government and when I first came in. If you were here five years, you could look up and say "well, I 'm here five years, I should be at this with acceptable performance" ; neither real good nor real bad, but acceptable . The carrot and the stick used to be, if it was unacceptable you got noticed that way and you either improved or you were gone . So, fundamentally, that ' s the question that I 'm asking, because across the board general increase is fine, and particularly under tight conditions like this, but as we have a better economy and a better situation, how does the employee move through that range until they get to that topped out position, if they ever get there? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Okay. I may have a slide that might get us there; it may not, but I 'm going to ask to flip over to 13 , kind of odd number, Performance Management Transition. Here ' s what we are saying, in summary. July 1 , 2008 , we ' d like to modify our plan, our form, to have the quantification or those ratings and levels . In using that , we would apply this Exceptional Performance Bonus . In other words , based on those objectives that they' ve been using all year long, starting July 1st each department will then say July 15th you get your rating, and everybody has slightly different ratings across the time frame of July through June . But once all of those evaluations have been done, the 26 Department Director and his team of Supervisors will sit down and say, "Back in July, October, and on through the year we have ' x ' number of people that are rated as exceptional, meeting the criteria . " They would get an allocated amount of this money. Take those dollars and say, "Now, how do we want to then divide these dollars up to give to these exceptional performers , knowing that the ceiling of 20% is there? " Every department will understand that . We would then take that and at the last paycheck in June those employees would then receive that bonus . If you do it anytime earlier on, you could, you run the risk of not giving something to the people that are rated later during the year . So, that ' s why we say to sit down at the end of the year, maybe mid-June or early June, and then make that decision on how those people receive the bonuses ; that ' s July 1 of 2008 . Then July 1 of 2009 , we would come in with a totally new form that ' s getting at that whole pay per performance approach, putting back in those performance levels, tie them directly into the pay, although we still have the $1 million for the second year of the biennium. But the criteria would be different, it would be more specific , everybody would understand it, we would have trained over 600 Supervisors on how to do this, we would have Communications groups, and I have a Communications person here that works very closely with us on all of these kinds of things , so we will make sure that all of this is well communicated and people truly understand it . Again, the same thing would happen, in terms of those Exceptional Performance Bonus Award dollars . Then July 1 of 2010 , everybody should then be on board. They know how the system works . We would convert totally over, and if the dollars are available from the budget , we would then start with this system which in effect will move people across the range . In other words, if you ' re doing, let ' s say, we ' re giving 3% , the 3% , call it Merit, call it Performance Increase, 3% . If you said just meet the expectations , you may get 1% . If you exceed some but not all of the expectations you may get 2% . If you exceed all of the expectations, you ' d get 3% . So, it just depends on how well you performed. Some people would get to the top of the range faster than others . That ' s kind of the concept we have . We don ' t have all of the answers yet, but that ' s the plan that we ' re laying out, and it is in concert with what we heard from the Blue Ribbon Group. We had a committee led by Ms . Spencer over here, and the former Deputy Police Chief, who ' s now in Charleston. This thing has been going on now for almost two years , and we 've studied a lot of different best practices . 27 We brought all of that back together, and this is what we ' re now sharing with the City Council so that we can change the effort, change the approach, change the way that we are doing performances and that will allow us to move across the ranges . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Dyer? COUNCILMAN DYER: Thank you . I appreciate the presentation. During the deliberations of the Blue Ribbon Task Force, we did come to a conclusion, number one, that the City of Virginia Beach was the largest employer in the City, and Number 2 , Compensation was the biggest driver that we have had. Listening to a panel of the delegation last week at the CCO Meeting, they really painted a dismal picture of the future that we ' re looking into . They said things are actually going to get worse than we thought . And I really don ' t think that we ' re going to be taking the situation seriously until we really start to take a hard look in downsizing Government and doing what a lot of industry are doing and a lot of other governments and things of that nature . You know, we have a lot of people here, and I think if we can expect our tax payers to feel pain, one of the things we discussed was sharing the burden, and there are ways that we can downsize effectively, in terms of number of personnel through attrition, early retirement, and a few other things . And if I 'm not mistaken, the City of Portsmouth was able to give a 3% raise by looking forward to downsizing the scope of government . And the thing is that the Military, private industry, other governments , are learning how to operate leaner in the current environment, what we ' re facing, in terms of economics , and I think we have to take a serious look how to deliver, still deliver, key services but do it with less personnel like everybody else is doing. MAYOR OBERNDORF: With all due respect, the problems also arise when someone calls City Hall, and after you downsize you have people that are legitimately busy pursuing something that came in first , and the person who can ' t get the individual attention to help them resolve their problem, I know you must have gotten some of the phone calls , call the elected body because they don ' t connect the downsizing to perhaps a diminishment of personal attention that they can get . Say somebody forgot to pick up both the regular garbage and the recycling, and they' re very frustrated after a week goes by and no one has been able to remove the recycling or whatever, then they tend to call me in frustration. 28 And as long as anything you do does not really make an obvious change in the quality of the service that is being offered to the individual citizen, then we ' ve accomplished something. But I 'm not saying that you don ' t look at tightening the belt, but you have to be aware that there are also reactions to the fact that if the service is not able to be given in a reasonable amount of time, people become very concerned that they still aren ' t getting value for the tax they ' re paying . COUNCILMAN DYER: Madam Mayor, if I may? A number of organizations have downsized through necessity over time, and they found out by using different management techniques and work redesign and a few other things that they' re actually still able to deliver services efficiently; in some areas more efficiently. And then once again, now, the savings you hope we can implement a productivity system, a type of reinforcement system, that would encourage higher performance . So, it ' s not necessarily an equitable reduction in personnel and equally a reduction in services that necessarily has to occur . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: When they cut off this, I had another topic . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. I 'm sorry? COUNCILMAN DYER: I 'm fine . Thank you. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Anyone else want to ask? COUNCILMAN WOOD: I mean, it ' s still the Compensation topic . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: I notice your next slide says "questions " ? FAGAN STACKHOUSE: Yes , I 'm pretty well wrapping it up here . COUNCILMAN WOOD: One thing that I neglected to do earlier, I wanted to thank you for allowing Mrs . Hilliard to help us with the auditor selection. She was very valuable in that and brought some experience that we, John and I, certainly didn ' t have and we appreciate that . We apologize that you had to sit through eight hours of that , 29 but we really appreciate that . One of the things I had asked staff for and I haven' t gotten it back yet -- FAGAN STACKHOUSE : It ' s coming in the next few hours . COUNCILMAN WOOD: -- correlation between sick leave and overtime and that sort of thing. And I guess my concern is when you take a look at the amount of sickleave used throughout the organization, it averages just about eight days per employee . Some departments have significantly higher, some departments have significantly lower . And then there ' s $11 . 4 million in overtime in 2007 ; obviously, some of that is emergency related, a pipe burst or something like that that has to be done, 453 , 000, roughly, hours of overtime, but I think a lot of that probably is related to sick leave . I know there are some departments that, minimum staffing standards, they have to have so many people working at a specific time or they have to call people in. And I was just taking a look, if you have your hypothetical $40 , 000-a-year employee who makes roughly $20 an hour, you ' re bringing one in now for $30 an hour to pay for those people, to pay for this person to backfill . And I guess my question is, and I had asked the question and the response was not a whole lot, what we do to incentivise people to not take sick leave, because if you take a look at what happens at the end of your career, you basically get $3 . 50 per hour . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : $28 a day. COUNCILMAN WOOD: Yes . Divide that out by eight hours , you get $3 . 50 per hour . And when you take a look at how much it cost you when you have to backfill an employee and bring somebody in for overtime, it would seem to me that there needs to be some sort of incentive program in place to incentivise employees to not abuse the sick leave policy. Obviously, if somebody is genuinely sick, they' re genuinely sick, but I don ' t think that we have a workforce that is so unhealthy that everybody in the workforce is taking a sick day every other month because they ' re that sick. And I know, and of course the Sheriff is a different entity because he ' s a Constitutional Officer, he does things differently, but I know he ' s got examples of how he incentivises people not to take sick leave and it doesn ' t cost him a whole lot of money when he presents people gifts and things like that . And I 'm wondering, there ' s got to be something that we can do 30 to reduce this number, whether it ' s some sort of creative use of the sick leave, if maybe it could be applied towards VRS at the end of your career or anything like that so that we don ' t have this . Because when you look at $11 . 4 million in overtime, that ' s a lot of money, and it ' s even more when you look at the number of hours . I mean, 453 , 000 hours is just a heck of a lot of time, and I ' d be interested in staff trying to come up with some ideas that could incentivise people not to use overtime -- not to use sick leave, rather . Overtime is what it is, and I think there ' s some departments that may be using more than they should, but that ' s another whole topic . FAGAN STACKHOUSE : We can certainly take a look at that, and we can also dust off, again, Ms . Spencer had a committee, I don ' t know how many years back, where we came up with a number of recommendations that could be used. It can be tacked on to the end of retirement, can be that you didn ' t use "x" number of days, sick days, or none, then you may get a vacation day or you may get something else . Prior to coming here, we had kind of a cash system, where we paid persons the actual value and figured it out mathematically that it would work okay, but that ' s twenty-some years ago . But there ' s a lot that ' s being done in that field; it ' s a matter of if we can zero it out in terms of cost . Back then, we couldn ' t figure out a way to zero it out, but then we look at the value of what you ' re talking about, there may be some things there that we can introduce and make happen. We certainly have the ideas; it ' s not that we don ' t . COUNCILMAN WOOD: I ' d like to see whatever y' all could come up with, because I think it ' s something that could be certainly a cost saver for the City. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Uhrin, followed by Mr . Villanueva? COUNCILMAN UHRIN: Thank you, Madam Mayor . I guess , just going back to Jim ' s example, there may be some real cost-effective ways of doing it, because in that particular example, that twenty-hour slot ended up costing the City $50, by the time you paid the overtime and you paid the employee who was sick. So, I think that ' s probably got an awful lot of merit to really look at some programs that may help with that . And I 've heard that from many different people in the past , so that may be an opportunity for improvement . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Villanueva? 31 COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Fagan, I appreciate your going over this . With regards to the 453 , 000 hours overtime, is it mostly Public Safety and Public Works have the majority of overtime hours? FAGAN STACKHOUSE : I 'm not sure how it ranks out , but I know that Public Works , Public Utilities , now I 'm calling out the higher users by virtue of the nature of their work, Police and Fire, the Fire Department , and Human Services . Human Services is fairly large . It ' s the largest department we 've got . We 've got over 1 , 000 people in Human Services, and they do a very valuable job, as well; it ' s just different kind of work. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I understand. As we all know, we ' ve had this discussion for a lot of particularly the Oceanfront problems ; a lot of overtime hours are expended by our Police personnel down there . I 'm again putting it on the table that we do need a real viable solution for the Oceanfront behavior and -- COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I think you need to look a little closer than that, Ron. I would almost bet you it ' s Court time that drives the overtime clock with the Police Department, not the Oceanfront . If you need people at the Oceanfront, you need them. Have a nice day. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Well, Harry, if you remember, this is a topic for another discussion, but when we were looking at problems on the 21st Block and 17th Block at the Oceanfront, we can extract that data and you know there are millions of dollars expended on overtime hours just for those particular blocks in peak hours . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I ' d have to see some supporting data . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I can show it to you . CITY MANAGER: We ' ve worked on overtime and trying to control it . Keep in mind it ' s 2 . 1% of the personnel budget, which, not minimizing that, but I think you need to keep that perspective . And if you look at the kinds of things that are being done, they have to be done when they have to be done; if they have to be in Court, they have to be in Court, and so on. So, there ' s certain things we can do to control the use of overtime, but by and large it ' s an operational necessity. FAGAN STACKHOUSE : Thank you for your time . 32 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you, Mr . Stackhouse . (Whereupon, the discussion of this matter was concluded. ) 7 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN 2:39 P.M. Susan Walston, Deputy City Manager,provided the attached presentation regarding Healthcare, which is attached and made a part of these proceedings, along with the Verbatim Transcript. April 15, 2008 (1) 0) - � 4- CO ^-^, �� o --L=L M PV'1 W 00 00 EC 'U p ca p 40 c N O N CO etii O Lo r- O N U W >1 .L _c •_L: X -e-a 6 Q U) Q MM N 'W V J 0 '- a) V) E O o U cn 0) c c co a3 Tx3 L U CoC p 0 N CD N — 2 c CVdj O72 L ca cn O t -co 2 ,c 0 . 0) 2 _, c o 4_, c 2 Oa, 0 ° T2 > U 0 ri 2 o 6- curl cy) _ c c3 o u)-- Amt c .... — 0 _ c i4-_-_-_ a_ 6 u) ,.... c +-' .L a)( CD Cr) (X3 C i) co mN � LL Ctl a) CO = M M a 4-- 1:3O � o co QU +--‘ = co .L. 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McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E . Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L . Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS 2 SUSAN WALSTON: We wanted to move ahead into the Health Care Update . Just to let you know, we are coming back to you today and the School Board also has a follow-up briefing next week. A little background for you, we came and we briefed you on March 11th, and there was a number of questions that day from both you, the Council , and also the School Board, and those went back out to you on March 21st and the School Board on March 29th. The context of that briefing was mainly around a Three-Year Strategy to Control our Increasing Costs . We were looking at ways do address Plan Design, both City Contributions and Employee Premiums, Medical Management, and GASB Funding. And while we have made changes, we have seen more positive trend or reduced trend, but we know that health care costs are going to continue, so we need to continue to look at it . If I could refresh you on the goals , just to remember what we ' re trying to do in health care based on what we ' ve heard from you and from our employees, we want to be in a position to continue to offer affordable quality health care but do so in a way that controls the cost; maintain a healthy workforce, and then look at the best prices for services and programs and health risks , along with this whole idea of change, change in the plans, the way that we deliver health care, change in the way that employees are part of their health care, and that our partners, such as our providers, do their share in making the difference in our trend. We mentioned health awareness and education from both City and Schools Employees . They ' re saying this is a critical element . The more they learn the more they understand how they may have a more controlling aspect in their own health care. And there is willingness from some of these employees to help in this education and awareness, as far as what do employees need to know, and how might this education information be provided to them in different ways . Before we get to the actual recommendations , I want to let you know what we ' re working on now as a follow-up to our briefing. The 2007 Claims Audit on schedule now to advertise an RFP for that in May, receive responses back in June, and actually conduct the audit July through September . Based on what we ' ve heard, we are trying to put the RFP together that allows for vendors to respond in both either a flat rate or a contingency basis , which has been mentioned here before, where there might be a payment based on a percentage recovered. So, we ' re looking at both options and hope to be able to advertise that RFP that gives reputable companies who want to do business 3 with the City an option to present either way. And we have a number of companies both ways that do audits in both ways, so we would solicit, also, in that regard. The GASB 45 Funding and Policy we have on your three-month agenda tentatively the beginning of June to come back to you and allow you to act on setting a funding policy for GASB that ' s required by June 30th, also, to take action to appropriate the Annual Required Contribution. And remember, the good news is from our first valuation to our second there ' s been a 32% reduction in what that is based on changes to date, and also create the trust mechanism or join the trust mechanism that we have to have to set aside these funds . Health Care Self Insurance Fund Monitoring and Policy, both the auditors from the City side and the Schools side have been developing a methodology, and the Benefits Executive Committee will engage in a more routine basis, probably quarterly, to keep monitoring the fund, and then we also will work toward establishing a policy. I think the last time we were here, we talked about establishing a reserve as probably pretty critical . We ' re in the great position to be in the positive after 2007 , and we would like to see that we establish a reserve of one-month ' s claim. Based on 2007 costs , that ' s about $8 million. Then the fund can also be used in the future depending on how we move ahead to help fund the GASB funding as we move forward, reduce projected increase in contributions, both the City and the employee side, possibly, and also, as we move forward, establishing the Health Savings Accounts . I think a big thing with the Health Care Self Insurance Fund is just make sure that we follow up on the fact that there ' s $17 million there at the end of 2007 . If we make no changes to the plan, we don ' t increase the City contribution, and we don ' t increase the employee contribution, and we have a normal trend of anywhere increasing costs from 6-10% , by 2010 we ' ll experience a deficit again. So, we have to look at that as we move forward and make plans for that . 2009 Rate Setting, well, obviously what we ' re asking for in recommendations from you helps us get going on that , but around the June period we ' ll try to review six months worth of claims for this year . We know how we did in 2007 , but how have we done in 2008? And we ' re looking to, once the plan design is established, the rates would be set and our goal , as indicated to you, to begin to adjust the premium rates to cover the true costs of each tier in each coverage and begin to reduce the implicit subsidy that exists in some categories . 4 The additional work that we need to do in the Three-Year Strategy that will begin work on 2010 and 2011 Fiscal Years is we ' re projecting to create the High Deductible Health Plan with a Health Savings Account and plan in January 1 , 2010 . That gives us a full year for education, it allows us to work to take our current basic Catastrophic Plan, convert that to a High Deductible Plan and look through the mechanism for a Health Savings Account and offer that as a voluntary basis, have people educated on how to use that to be better controllers of their health costs . The beauty of that , once again, is it ' s attractive to younger employees ; it ' s attractive because it ' s portable and allows you to begin saving for the future . And we also are looking at studying other issues, once again looking at the issue of co-insurance; should we be supplementing co-insurance and replacing co-pays? Should we look at the service years that someone has to work here before they have access to Retiree Health Care? Do we look at beginning to restrict both eligibility and plan choices to future employees, future retirees, or the existing workforce? And then, continue to look at incentives for healthy behaviors and disincentives for risky behavior; so, those are kind of what we ' re working on as we go forward. And I guess the gist of coming back to you today as a follow-up to March 11th is to, once again, ask for your direction on the recommendations proposed for 2009 . Once again, we ' re recommending that the City ' s contribution, City and Schools contribution, remain at the 2008 level, which is $5, 400 for both 2009 and 2010 , and that we had also suggested that we not conduct an RFP on a fully-insured plan. This has really mixed emotions, but, as indicated to you in the request that you asked for information from Mercer, our consultant, just to remind you a little bit, in 2007 we did an RFP for the self-insured plan and we had a new contract with our third party administrator, Optima, that started January 1 , 2008 . What we found out from that and why Optima was selected is because they provided the highest discounts and lowest administrative fees of the other responders . We had two national companies that did not even respond, because they don ' t have the service network in the area, and two other people that did respond didn ' t match up to what was obtained from Optima, so we went with them. We think just from the estimate from Optima to convert the self insured plan to fully insured would cost us an extra $7 million, a 7% increase, and we know it would cost us some money to do an RFP . So, our recommendation is not to conduct that , but I know there is still a lot of talk about that . 5 And there might be the consideration is let us get through this Three-Year Strategy, which also correlates with the first three years of our current provider where we go to annual renewals . And if the desire is still to test this, that might be the time to do an RFP where we could get responders to put in proposals from either a self-insured or fully-insured plan. Our recommendation is at this point not to conduct the RFP on fully insured. Plus , the amount of time it takes, we ' re getting later in the year where that would be available for 2009 . Plan Design Changes, once again, we recommend the deductible on all the plans, with the example for the HMO, $100 for individual, $200 for family, but this would be deductible on all plans, and the deductible is significant and used in many plans because it ' s the first out of pocket . It also has a huge, it tends to have a big, impact on GASB, as well as the annual expenses , but let me assure you, these are changes we ' re recommending . What is not a recommended change is the out-of-pocket maximum of $1 , 500 per individual and $3 , 000 for family, and we ' re also not recommending any increases next year in co-pays . Retiree Rates, we recommend for equity reasons, as well as impact on GASB, that the City rates are aligned with the School Retiree Rates . In 2008 in an HMO retiree-only, the Schools retirees are paying $33 a month. On a Point-of-Service Plan, retirees are paying $40 a month. We are recommending that the City move to those rates that have been established by Schools for starting to recover some of the cost . Another recommendation is to eliminate the free premium that exists with the employee only on the HMO and that we initiate some cost share in the premium rate recommended starting at $10 a month on the HMO . That ' s a big deal , because 54% of the people on the plan now are employee only. As I said, those are changes . Just one good thing that comes out of this, as of 2009 on the HMO plans, no referrals are required, will be required, under that plan. So, those are the changes we recommend as we work through some of the bigger issues . Those recommended changes total a $3 . 7 million savings, also, in the annual cost, and also reduce the GASB liability by $6 . 3 million, which impacts the Annual Required Contribution. So, I stand ready to respond to some of your questions in an effort to try and go through this and not repeat the full March 11th briefing. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. DeSteph? 6 COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I just had one quick question, actually two quick things; one, I ' d like to get you to expand on one of the things we discussed on this earlier, and the second on the "no referrals " . When Harry and I had the committee on this, that was one of the things we were noticing; people would go back and forth and back and forth for referrals four or five times, running up the cost . So, this will actually save a lot of money. SUSAN WALSTON: This should help the members on the plan, yes . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: But can you talk a little bit about the $17 million overage, how that ' s being used? I think that ' s important for everybody to kind of understand that . SUSAN WALSTON: Yes . The $17 million surplus right now in the Health Care Self Insurance Fund, just to take you back between 2001 and 2007 , we actually had three years or actually four years that we were in a deficit position, and we 've had three years that we 've been equal or above . And typically, the differential has been anywhere from a deficit of $3 million to an overage of $3 million. So, we ' ve had a wonderful year in 2007 , and it ' s caused by a number of things, and we ' re at the cumulative $17 million surplus . We ' ve had a better cost trend, which means that employees and retirees are helping us with utilization, but our costs haven ' t increased as much. In reality, it ' s also the result of some of our health changes in 2006 and 2007 , and a big deal is that the contribution that the City and Schools gave increased dramatically. In 2006 , the City ' s contribution went up 10% . The Schools ' contribution went up 15% . That same year, the average increase to employee premiums was 4% . Just to remind you, in the Health Fund, 80% of the fund revenue comes from the City and School contributions; 20% comes from the employee, employee retiree contributions . In 2007 , the City increased its contribution by 14%, the Schools increased their contribution by 18%, and the average employee premium for 2007 actually went down 3% . So, a great deal of the surplus in the fund is the ongoing increase in contribution from City and Schools with the help of the employees ' utilization and plan changes . We 've never in my experience, and I don ' t know before my time, since we 've gone to self-insured we never have had that level 7 of balance . There have been years where we ' ve had significantly less than break-even, but I think we ' ve done pretty well . So, we 've turned a corner on this, but as I told you, if we do nothing from where we are now, we have an average trend of 6-10% increase, we ' ll have a deficit Year 2010 . So, that ' s why we want to cautiously look at a policy for that fund balance and how it might be used in the future, that we ' d have to review the health of the fund on a quarterly basis but make suggestions on how to use the fund annually. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . DeSteph, you have some follow-up? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Just two quick points on follow-up . One key point is, our staff and management ask the employees to be more diligent of when and how they ' re using their health care that ' s provided, since we are self-funded. And they have listened and done that , so that ' s been of great assistance . Part of this will be used in a reserve or go to reserve to handle any catastrophes . I just wanted to make sure that that ' s kind of conveyed, as well . SUSAN WALSTON: We think that should be the first -- COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Yes , and I think that ' s important, as well . So, those are just two things I wanted to point out . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Any other questions by other Members of Council? SUSAN WALSTON: And I would ask at this point , is there enough of a comfort level by Council that you could give some sense that we ' re moving in the right direction and you could support these changes for 2009? I think the $5 , 400 goes without saying that that is a comfort level, that ' s the contribution for the next two years . Are you comfortable at this point that we not go ahead with an RFP for a fully-insured plan? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Diezel? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Madam Mayor, I am comfortable with it . I won ' t speak for Bill , but very slowly but surely they ' re headed in the direction your subcommittee put together with some of their recommendations . We didn ' t anticipate getting to all of them in one move . We ' ve been able to reduce the GASB impact, the contribution, increased contribution, by the employees, all of that is going to contribute to that and I suspect maintain that surplus for future Council discussion and distribution. 8 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Mr . Jones? VICE-MAYOR JONES : I think I 'm comfortable with what Susan has presented with the idea that after the three-year period we may want to look at that time at doing an RFP, as far as an insured plan for one of two or both reasons ; number one, as I understand it from you, Susan, the management contract comes up at that time, is that correct? SUSAN WALSTON: Well , the contract we began in January of this year is for three years and then it has annual one-year renewals . So, after three years in the three-year strategy, it might be an appropriate time if we wanted to go back out . VICE-MAYOR JONES: If we ' re going to bid that, we might as well bid the insured plan, bid to see what we could get on an insured plan at the same time . So, I would say, go through these stages of change in the plan, get to that point, and that ' s when we would do a bid, if we ' re going to do one; that ' s the first point I ' d make . Second thing is, I think, as far as the premium is concerned, I think you ought to make each year stand on its own, as far as premium is concerned, and not plan on using any of this reserve to offset premiums, because if you started doing that you get back into the same situation that we ' re trying to get out of with this GASB thing. So, I think we need to stay away from that . We need to make each year, as far as the premium that we ' re charging and or allocating, stand on its own to avoid that happening again to us . That ' s all . Those are my two comments . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: And the last piece to this , from my standpoint , is that we ' re still moving forward with the RFP for somebody to audit the last 6 to 18 months , whatever it was , of claims . SUSAN WALSTON: Yes . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: And, again, when we brought this up in the past, there ' s multiple companies out there that will do this for a portion of the claims recovered or for different formulas of that . So, we ' re putting an RFP together to put that out to figure out the best way to do this . And, again, the benefit, the return on 9 investment for the City and the benefit of that, I think, from everything I 've read and the folks from our Task Force, it ' s going to be significant where the payback will be somewhere between $3 for every $1 or up to $7 , especially when the companies say they ' ll do it for 3-7% of what they recover -- I 'm sorry, a portion of what they recover, but they anticipate recovering 3-7% of what was spent on claims . So, that ' s pretty significant . SUSAN WALSTON: And I think I skipped one, too . In addition to the Claims Audit, we are also, as we mentioned to you last time, looking to conduct a Dependent Audit . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes, you did mention it . SUSAN WALSTON: Just to review, determine dependent eligibility after a grace period to see if that is an area that we can address as another way to reduce costs by eliminating ineligible members on the plan . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Uhrin -- May I ask you, if someone is married to a member of the Military and, therefore, are covered by the health care in the Military system, do we encourage them to continue their dependency on the Military health care but give them some type of bonus to incentivise their not being on the City plan if they have access to that? SUSAN WALSTON: We do not do that at this time, but one of the things we need to look at is what might be encouraging people and directing people to be members of a health plan other than the City, if they have it available, whether or not it ' s dependents , whether or not it ' s spouses . There are some restrictions right now from the Federal Government on what you can do to incent members of the Military community from not taking your plan. It works against us . So, we just have to work within legal parameters and guidelines in that area . Remember, this issue came up maybe two years ago at this point , and I think the idea of if people have other options to health care, how can we encourage them to use those rather than the City ' s plan, but we do have some restrictions on how we do that . But right now, we don ' t pay out any bonus or any incentive if someone chooses another plan; they just don ' t get the City contribution. MAYOR OBERNDORF: May I ask, just for clarification, you referred to the numbers involved 10 with the contribution on the City side -- I mean, on the School Board side, $33 and something else? SUSAN WALSTON: That ' s the premium monthly payment, yes, Ma ' am. MAYOR OBERNDORF: And that ' s what the School Board puts in? SUSAN WALSTON: No, no . That ' s what the retiree pays, a School retiree pays, where the City retiree for an HMO right now is paying $5 per both; that ' s what we want to make equal . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. That ' s what I was trying to understand. SUSAN WALSTON: The City and Schools employer contribution is equal at this point, yes , Ma ' am, but our retiree premium rates aren ' t equal . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, I can tell you, in the private sector everybody is picking up more and more of their health care costs even after they' re on retirement . SUSAN WALSTON: I think that ' s the challenge we face here, how we offer health care as part of a total compensation package but deal with realities that are occurring everywhere around us, in terms of the increased costs . I must admit, for employees, whether it ' s at the City or otherwise, this idea of what we talked about earlier, compensation increasing less than it has in the past but the cost of taking care of your family and making a living is growing, health care feeds right into that as one of the greatest increased costs to members across the country. MAYOR OBERNDORF: I understand. SUSAN WALSTON: I know everyone in this room understands, I 'm sure . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Any other questions for Mrs . Walston? SUSAN WALSTON: Are you comfortable with the actual plan design changes listed? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I 'm not making a commitment to that, 11 Mrs . Walston. You know, I asked for some questions . You called me to come in to meet with you . SUSAN WALSTON: Well, I offered, if you wanted to . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Yes, if I wanted to . I am not at this point about any part of this budget until we 've had the opportunity for public input, Public Hearings , and I want to be sure that I ' ve heard from the people who are directly involved. And, obviously, I 'm not the majority of the Council , but have you had much comment or question from public employees, other than those committees? SUSAN WALSTON: Well, we 've gotten some questions that have come in since the recommendations that we ' re getting back on. As I say, there ' s a sense of fear because they don ' t know what the premium rates are, and we ' re saying we can ' t set the premium rates until we get some direction on what the Council and the School Board are comfortable with plan design changes . Just to clarify, for the budget, Mrs . McClanan, what ' s in the budget that you will have to review and vote on is the $5 , 400 contribution for 2 years and the $5 million on the City side and the $3 . 5 million on the School side each year for the GASB . Those are the budgetary -- COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: I 'm well aware of that . You explained that completely. SUSAN WALSTON: Okay. But we can ' t let the employees know what their premium rates are going to be until we design the plan. And I guess the direction we were looking for from you, I ' ve heard people say "this is too much" , I ' ve had other of you say "we ' re not doing enough" . So, there ' s some mixed feelings about the changes . And there ' s something else you asked about what employees are saying; I think employees are concerned because they haven ' t had a deductible before. That raises some level of concern. They were concerned because we mentioned we would re-visit co-insurance; that raised the issue again, and we 've had concerns expressed about the dependent age being different between City and Schools . Dot, I 'm looking at you, what big area have I missed in the input? I think those are the key areas . But the real question is, if I 'm only getting a 1 . 5% increase, how much of health care is going to take from that? As I say, the way we have to do this is review our 6 months ' worth of claims data, look at how that ' s impacting where we ' re going, have the plan design, and then we set the premium rates from that . I 'm not 12 sure, Mrs . McClanan, did that answer your question, or is there something else I can get you? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Don ' t let me hold you up . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, is the Council ready today to make the decision that Mrs . Walston is referring to about the $5, 400? You are? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I certainly am, yes . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. You want to start, then, around the table? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Start, I will . Yes . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Is it the 54 , or is it the moving ahead with doing the -- SUSAN WALSTON: Well, I guess, that question was $5, 400 is included as the City and Schools contribution in both years of your biennial budget . MAYOR OBERNDORF: And since we ' re talking about the budget, I thought everybody would like to know what we ' re committing to in $5 , 400 , City ' s and Schools ' , times by the number of employees that we have now, so we have some idea of what the financial impact is that we ' re agreeing to and not wake up another day and say "I didn ' t think about the total " . Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: You ' re just talking about $5 , 400 and not this question about whether or not we ' re doing the RFP on the fully-insured or the plan design changes? SUSAN WALSTON: I think that ' s how the Mayor presented the question at this point . COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: I wouldn ' t want to restrict it that close, Barbara. I 'm inclined to be very supportive of everything that she ' s put on the table up to this point and incorporate what Louis was talking about, in terms of at the end of that three-year process find out which of the procedures might be more cost effective . But this whole program, if you look at it in its entire package, one, it provides the services, and also cost containing, which I think that group has done a pretty good job with. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Walston, would you want to 13 explain one more time why the decision has to be made now as opposed to waiting for the Public Hearings and the ultimate -- SUSAN WALSTON: It ' s just for staff direction. You don ' t vote on a budget until May 13th. MAYOR OBERNDORF: We know that . SUSAN WALSTON: That would be when the $5 , 400 would be set . I guess, giving some indication if we ' re going, if you ' re okay with us not moving forward on an RFP, we really are even late to start that for 2009 , so that one has time sensitivity. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: You ' re looking for the answer if we ' re going to move forward on an RFP. VICE-MAYOR JONES: The $5 , 400 is already in the budget . SUSAN WALSTON: It ' s in your recommended budget, yes . VICE-MAYOR JONES: The real question is the policy decision. SUSAN WALSTON: The plan design. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: The plan design changes, the RFP . VICE-MAYOR JONES : The plan design policy decision regarding that, that ' s what she really needs to know. SUSAN WALSTON: We would probably start meeting, we ' re scheduling some meetings in May so that we could begin to with Mercer doing some actuarial analysis, if this is the contribution, if this is what our expense has been for the first months of 2008 , and if these plan design changes are in we would begin to look at what might be the premium rates, because our goal would be to establish them by June . So, we ' re just trying to get some direction so we can continue to work on that, awaiting your decision on the actual funding pieces that are part of your budget adoption, but this is the time of year when we start doing the rate setting. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. Mr . Uhrin? 14 COUNCILMAN UHRIN: And the rate setting is based on the program redesigns you discussed today and throughout the briefing? SUSAN WALSTON: That ' s right . COUNCILMAN UHRIN: So, you ' re really not even asking for us to comment on the $5, 400 . You ' re asking for us to comment specifically on whether we ' re going to do the RFP right now or not, and the second thing would be the actual redesign of the components within the plan, itself , so that you can set the rates; is that correct? SUSAN WALSTON: I think that ' s great clarity, yes . VICE-MAYOR JONES : And the premium, bring it down to less than $5 , 400 , that goes into the reserve . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I 'm good with it . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Dyer? Mrs . Henley? Mr . Villanueva? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I 'm going to wait until May 13th. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . McClanan, you were going to wait? COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: Yes . I don ' t know what I might do on May 13th, and I sure don ' t know what I 'm going to do today. I just am not a person who knows that far ahead. Thank you. MAYOR OBERNDORF: You ' re welcome . Based on the reports you 've been given and wanting to get some feel for how we ' re going to provide for the health care of our folks and what it will ultimately entail for them in the new plan design, yes . Mr . Jones? VICE-MAYOR JONES: I 'm okay. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Wilson said yes . Mr . Wood? Mr . Uhrin? And Mr . Diezel? COUNCILMAN DIEZEL: Yes , Ma ' am. 15 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Anybody I missed? Eleven of us? SUSAN WALSTON: Thank you very much. MAYOR OBERNDORF: You ' re welcome . (Whereupon, the discussion of this matter was concluded. ) 8 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN 3:27P.M. Warren Harris, Director—Economic Development, provided the attached presentation, which is attached and made a part of these proceedings, along with the Verbatim Transcript. 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CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT VERBATIM CITY COUNCIL Meyera E . Oberndorf, Mayor At-Large Louis R. Jones , Vice-Mayor Bayside - District 4 William R. DeSteph At-Large Harry E. Diezel Kempsville - District 2 Robert M. Dyer Centerville - District 1 Barbara M. Henley Princess Anne - District 7 Reba S . McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E . Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L. Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS 2 CITY MANAGER: Next, we have Economic Development, and related to that is Strategic Growth Areas . Warren Harris is going to do the Economic Development Department overview and program review very quickly, and then Jack is going to talk about the Strategic Growth Areas and they' re kind of intertwined. WARREN HARRIS: Mr . Spore, thank you very much. Madam Mayor, Members of Council, good to be with you this afternoon . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Good to have you. WARREN HARRIS: I ' ll present to you the Economic Development Overview. You have our outline, our presentation outline, there in front of you, and very clearly our mission is pretty distinct and clear, to grow our economy by attracting good quality businesses to our community; of course, retaining those existing businesses that are part of our community, and of course the outcome being creating the jobs that we desire as a community for our citizens . And I know a very important point to this Body has always been how that also plays an important role in enhancing the quality of life of our community, as well . The pie chart there in the presentation shows the outcomes, the breakdown of our Department budget . The piece I 'm going to focus on specifically for you today is the Operating portion, the 23% piece there in the graph, and the Director ' s Office . You see the 2007 Actual of 2 . 53 million, in terms of the budget at that point , adjusted to 2 . 175, proposed at 2 . 45 , a percentage change decrease of 1% , and going in 2010 , 2 . 158 . Regarding our Program Impacts , what we have to do to look at how we will meet our budget obligations this year, we looked at three specific areas to accommodate that requirement . Of course, primarily our core business relates and falls within these core areas . We had to look at our Marketing Travel, our Advertising and Website Initiatives, and how we will incorporate our initiatives in the Minority and Women-Owned Business Initiatives . Giving you a little bit of history, some of this you know -- I 'm sorry, Madam Mayor? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Excuse me . Mr . Villanueva? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Sorry, Warren. 3 WARREN HARRIS: No problem. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: First, I want to thank you and your staff for your help on Plaxico Burress coming here . WARREN HARRIS : It was a great day. It turned out very nice . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: With regards to Minority and Women-Owned Business Initiatives, can you clarify what is there on the table? WARREN HARRIS : Well, it ' s a new initiative that obviously the Council has put a lot of effort and direction in, in terms of focusing in that area, and it ' s an important complement of our overall economic development program. It will , and it takes commitment of funding to really achieve the level of penetration in that market that we ' d like to see, being the newest program we ' re just really not going to be able to accelerate that, quite frankly, as fast as we ' d like . So, it ' s going to be a steady process, as opposed to one that probably would be more aggressive if we really were in a position to do so . So, we ' re not eliminating the initiatives ; it ' s too important to eliminate the focus of that area, but we ' re just not going to at this point , having this requirement, step it up at the level we think we should. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: If I can supplement what Warren is saying? What we ' re doing is actually partnering up with some Federal and State programs to avoid duplication of efforts . But in that same sense, Minority and Women-Owned Business Initiatives , there ' s a lot of buying economic power in that area, as you guys know. MAYOR OBERNDORF: We ' re familiar with that . WARREN HARRIS : Well, really, it ' s the fastest growing area of business development , and it ' s an area that Council has really focused on. And thanks for your point, "partnering" , and that ' s what we ' re going to have to do more and more of is partnerships . And, Mayor, thank you for that great interview on hearsay, talking about the initiatives that we 've recently conducted with the Small Business Administration, hosting seminars; as a matter of fact, one tonight on specific points for small businesses to understand if they' re going to expand and grow in our community. 4 COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Thanks , Warren. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. DeSteph, did you raise your hand? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Yes . I just have two quick questions . These are expenditures for Fiscal Year 2009 , which are being proposed, correct? WARREN HARRIS: Uh-huh. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Do you have in here the revenues that actually offset that, is my first question, the revenues these are coming from? My second question, SGA, I believe, is Strategic Growth Area; what ' s that $500, 000 specifically going to be used for? CITY MANAGER: We 've got a whole presentation on SGA ' s that Jack ' s going to do, if you can just hold that thought . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. WARREN HARRIS: Where the revenues come from, they ' re general operating revenues that come from -- CATHERYN WHITESELL: The Director ' s Office, that is true. Special Service District, that ' s the Town Center. Special Services District, that ' s the 50-cent tax, I believe . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: I just want to be clear that for the $1 . 4 million we ' ve got $1 . 4 million from the SSD, from the Town Center TIF, that ' s going to generate $5 , 296 , 567 this year? WARREN HARRIS: Correct . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Okay. I just wanted to be kind of clear on that . CATHERYN WHITESELL: And the same thing with the Reserve for Contingencies; that ' s related to the SSD, so that ' s covered, as well . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: So, $500 , 000 from SGA' s, the revenue side of that comes from? CATHERYN WHITESELL: The proposal increases and the 5 machinery and tools personal property tax and the proposed increase in cigarette tax. COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Thank you . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Please? WARREN HARRIS: Yes, Ma ' am. Results of 2007 listed there, it shows you really some of the outcomes of the work done by a number of people, including those of you all in the room, in helping us to attract new businesses , expand those existing businesses that are equally as important, the jobs that were created last year, well over 1 , 100 of those, jobs retained, meaning, those projects that we worked with that were looking at other cities that fortunately decided to stay within the City, the absorption of square footage as a result of this effort with new and expanding businesses, well over 1 . 7 million square feet of absorption in the marketplace, and well over $258 million of new capital investment as a result of those initiatives . Going into our Operating Budget, an Operating Budget of 2 . 145 , that really gives you a real thorough breakdown of how we ' re going to allocate our operating dollars, in terms of the various initiatives within the department; whereas, personnel is a large percentage, but outside of that really our depth and breadth of our program is in the area of marketing travel and advertising . And we hope to expand on that as we talk about some of the initiatives that the department will engage in going forward. When we look at the Economic Development Department, we sort of look at ourselves as three businesses in one, in essence, because we have some areas in which we do play particular attention in. And one, of course, and one that ' s probably the most familiar, the Business Development and Marketing component part of our department, the whole idea that we ' re out there looking to grow our economy by attracting new businesses through business development and attraction. And a piece that I keep wanting to mention and not get lost in that discussion, that is the importance of retaining existing businesses and helping them to expand in the community. We talked about one of our newest initiatives , a growing area, the Women and Minority Business Initiatives, our support and work with the Oceana Land Use Conformity, one of the outcomes of the work being done by that committee will be to solicit and hire a business relocation specialist . We ' re in that process right now, funded through those proceeds that are assigned to this initiative, to help us to attract, well , to 6 acquire the appropriate properties necessary in the Oceana area and now begin to as we start the disposition of those properties to conforming uses that can theoretically locate in the Oceana area and hopefully grow and expand through that effort . We are equally, as we see communities like Virginia Beach, and, as I would like to say, world-class communities, find ourselves going more and more in public/private partnerships, that will be a trend and a component part of what we ' ll see going forward. And the newest component part in this area of business development and marketing, that is the creation of the new Military Economic Development Advisory Committee that the Council recently appointed, created, and the potential that brings for us to better connect with our Military facilities, both with the various commands that are now coming to those facilities and the privatization of some of those outcomes that result from that . As well , the exiting Military component that we ' re seeing coming out of our Military establishments , which we 've documented in the neighborhood of well over 16 , 000 annually coming out of the Military, which granted we won ' t capture all of them, but we can capture some of them and make that raw skill well-trained labor force available to our private sector partners here to help them in their need to expand and grow their employment and skills within their companies . The second area, our Staff Support to the Development Authority, the work we have in our responsibilities concerning the management of the parks and sites that are under their purview, their finances and operational requirements, and their role, in terms of facilitating on behalf of the City, development and implementation of various City initiatives and the projects associated with that . We have this other category we just labeled as "other" . We would theoretically look at them as the areas that concern us involving ourselves and Virginia Beach National, the golf course, the Amphitheater, some of those other important facilities that are also in the city that very much have an important economic development component to them. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr. Harris? WARREN HARRIS : Yes, Ma ' am? MAYOR OBERNDORF: I understand you did a beautiful job in trying to talk about the potential for industrial development near the airport between Norfolk 7 and Virginia Beach. And I also want to make note to the Council, the very first letter I received was from Captain Crow, who is the Base Commander at Little Creek, and his plea is if we truly want to show the Military how much we appreciate them and that would be to continue our funding of supplementing the money for the Chamber of Commerce ' s Political -- not Political, Patriotic Weekend. I knew it was a "P" , and I couldn ' t think of the word. And he was the very first person to write that that would be a continuing public significant input to let the people on active duty know just how much we value them. So, I thought I ' d bring that to you all right now, because there is going to be a list longer than I am tall of other things that weren ' t recommended in the budget this time; not your budget, but in general . When we talked about that Military Economic Development Advisory Committee and based on the potential hopefully, these folks getting out, if the Patriotic Weekend is the difference, I just want the Council to be sensitized to that . WARREN HARRIS: Mayor, thanks for those comments , too, about the area there, Northampton Boulevard corridor . That ' s one of the initiatives and we ' ll talk a little bit about that in the SGA brief where we have, based on your direction, looked at that corridor for the potential opportunity. There is a direct link to the Military because of its proximity and access to Little Creek, in particular, in its location, and it ' s work well worth it as we go forward in that area . Those other projects, well, let me go to the next one, Discussion Items, Economic Vitality Strategy, of course, that is a Council Priority, and, of course, looking at how we grow our economy. And as we look at moving forward with that important direction initiative one of the things that we ' ve been fortunate to brief you on earlier, in terms of us really going into and looking at Target Markets, looking at where the strategies , assets , and direction that this Body would like to see the City go, look at types of industry sectors that fit well with our tremendous assets . And we have fully embraced that strategy and are beginning to incorporate that into a lot of our material and a part of our strategy. The Alignment of Resources , that ' s going to be critical , obviously, not only with some of the issues you ' re addressing through the budget process, but how we align those resources to better fit the direction that we ' re trying to go, whether it be financial personnel or otherwise, to really align those resources , where we get the highest and greatest return on the 8 investment that we ' re placing in these critical areas . We 've talked about it . I think you are very well aware of this and the importance that it means to us as a City and as a region to really address this global economy piece and grow our business community through a global strategy. We ' re very fortunate to have some assets that speak well to this initiative, and we will begin and continue to grow that area . Workforce Development, you know, where you have seen and will continue to see more and more of the work of Economic Development not only being very focused on sites, buildings, and those types of assets, but more important about how we are going to put our workforce in place to really be a magnet to attract the types of industries we ' d like to see and the focus and emphasis that we ' ll be placing in that area is going to no doubt increase in the years to come . In the area, again, to reiterate the importance that the Women and Minority Business Development piece plays not only as a strategy but us as a City, being able to be attractive for these kinds of industries to look at Virginia Beach to do business . We mentioned earlier that the efforts we have made now and the strides that I think we ' ll see as an outcome from the creation of the Military Economic Development Advisory Committee and the strength that that will give us as a community and as a department to really get into some areas that we will probably have not have had the opportunity if we hadn ' t created this resource now closer to and with the City. There is a series of these special projects that are critically important to the Council ' s overall growing the economy strategy, the growth and expansion of Town Center and its benefit that it ' s accrued to not only this City but this region, beginning to look at some initiatives within the Resort area, both the Dome Site and of course the Headquarters Hotel Project . The Mayor mentioned, and let me again highlight the Burton Station work that has started and soon to start the work there in the Pembroke area, and of course there ' s work that ' s already started and soon to have some outcomes regarding the work in the Resort area, are also very important special projects that have our attention and will have us working very diligently, yet . So, with that, Madam Mayor, and Members of Council, that is the brief on Economic Development, and of course we ' ll be happy to respond or answer any questions . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Mr . Wood? COUNCILMAN WOOD: I had a couple of questions , Mr . Harris . I guess, the first one, given the very low level of State support, in terms of 9 incentivizing businesses to move to Virginia and specifically Virginia Beach, how do you foresee overcoming that and marketing Virginia Beach? WARREN HARRIS: Well , I think we need to use all of our tools , and in many ways I 'm a strong believer that many of the investments that have been made in the City serve as an incentive in some way. The fact that we have the Performing Arts Center and Aquarium and quality libraries and an excellent school system, that ' s an incentive, in itself . We need to as a department embrace those assets and structure them in a marketing piece that fits in a more aggressive format than maybe in the past . I think we need to partner, quite frankly, better with the existing tools that are out there, in terms of the real estate community and directly work with them in a stronger format . I think we need to reach out in the site location community. This past week we spent Friday in Northern Virginia . We had great appointments and meetings with site location decision makers, so we need more face-to-face and not rely on others necessarily to do the work that we need to do, ourselves . I think we can better work with the State, in terms of introducing and presenting and articulating what our assets are and not necessarily eliminate opportunities because we don ' t think we fit but to enhance and highlight those assets probably in a better way than what we ' ve done in the past . I think we ' re going to have to take control and not depend on others for our destiny, because you ' re right, those resources , because Virginia historically has not had a very aggressive incentive program, and so we ' re not going to see, unfortunately, those mega automotive plants; I mean, not to say that ' s appropriate development for Virginia Beach, but because Virginia Beach doesn ' t play -- I mean, Virginia doesn ' t play in that realm effectively, we ' re going to have to as a community rely on more and more of our own resources to get our word and our message out . I don ' t know if that answers your question. COUNCILMAN WOOD: That answered a lot more . WARREN HARRIS : I 'm sorry. COUNCILMAN WOOD: No, that was good. When we compare ourselves to other cities in the region, in terms of economic development spending, where does Virginia Beach fall; I mean, because obviously it ' s a pretty critical Council priority? 10 WARREN HARRIS: Being new, hopefully I can get away with this . The City is getting a good bang for their buck. We ' re not the largest, staff-wise, although we are the largest city in population and have the largest opportunity with the assets that we have to do greater things . Just off the top, the largest city in terms of staffing-wise is probably the City of Norfolk. Probably, behind that it would be the City of Newport News, and oddly enough even the City of Hampton has a greater staff population or staffing than we do . I believe, though, our numbers are in terms of what you get, we get, the citizens, for what ' s being invested in our department is something like $27 per person, in terms of the investment in turn of what the citizens receive for what ' s being put in based on the staffing and the budget . The next closest City, just to give you an example, would be the City of Chesapeake, and they ' re somewhere around $21 , in terms of population versus FTE ' s . COUNCILMAN WOOD: Okay. Then my final question has to do with the Economic Development Alliance . I guess, prior to your arrival when we had an interim director, one of the things he had mentioned was working with the Alliance to quantify what they' re actually bringing to us and coming up with some sort of system, and I 'm wondering how that part is going? WARREN HARRIS: Well , let me answer it in two ways, and I ' ll come to your question, specifically. The work with the Alliance, I think, is important to us as a City. My experience has been what you put in it is what you get out of it . And I think because we have a unique profile, as a community, we ' re very important to their mission, but they can play a very important part to ours . And what I 've seen and what we have directed the Alliance to do and they have done is really begin to embrace what our target industries are and program them into your or their marketing strategies . The result has been a specific trip that they did specifically for us . Madam Mayor, if you remember, we spent some time overseas in Israel specifically for Virginia Beach. This trip that I just talked about last week that arranged appointments for us to meet directly with site location decision makers was arranged with the Alliance specifically for Virginia Beach. There ' s International representatives in town this week. I had dinner with them Sunday night, so put us directly in front of them specifically for Virginia Beach. So, the relationship that we ' ve laid out in front of the alliance and the relationship that I have personally with the 11 alliance is causing, has caused, specific initiatives for Virginia Beach, specific , to take advantage of those dollars that we ' re putting into their program and us getting a more direct return on that . So, I think it ' s a new direction and quite frankly something that I think we ' re going to see some outcomes that will appreciate the fact of the level of funding that we ' re putting in there and the return that we ' re going to get back as a result of that . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Wilson? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: One thing about Warren is he ' s hit the ground running, and he ' s bringing a lot of energy to the department . When you talk about using our own resources , I really think we have a lot of resources here in the city that we probably haven ' t used very well, and that ' s our own people . And I would love for us to reach out to a lot of the business people who may not have contact with Economic Development to let them know who we are, what we do, and when they are out in their travels and what they hear about businesses wanting to relocate, to get in touch with your department, to be more aggressive in going out and getting contacts that we may not have known about otherwise. WARREN HARRIS: Right . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And then to, sort of like an ambassadorship program, when we are trying to lure people in we can call these people in to meet with new prospects so that they can talk about it . WARREN HARRIS: Well, that ' s important . That testimonial from the existing business community, someone other than me; I 'm the hired gun, and they would expect all the wonderful things to come out of the message points that I would or members of the staff would extend. But you ' re right, the engagement of those that are in the community yet are outside of the department that can really provide the testimony to why Virginia Beach makes sense is what makes the program; it ' s not us just saying we ' re great because we say we ' re great or some other publication said we ' re great . It ' s in our deeds and our actions, and the best way of doing that is engaging those that understand and appreciate and can extend our message . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: We were in the running for the AICPA group, who eventually went to the Raleigh area . And when we were in the running for those we should have called companies like Cherry, Beckert, and Goodman & Company, and the different CPA ' s here to talk to these folks 12 and say "this is such a great place" and why you should be here, and we never engaged that level of people in our community, and that ' s just an example, but that ' s sort of what we ought to be doing when we ' re looking to bring other people in. So, I would really like us to expand our base to really reach out to businesses that we ' ve never talked to . I 've had people call me that are in pretty good profile that really don ' t know who you are; not you, personally, who the department is . WARREN HARRIS : I understand. Right . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And they ' ll say, "Well , I heard such and such is looking to relocate" ; so, I immediately call someone . WARREN HARRIS: Right . That ' s important . We need to extend the word out there . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: We really need for them to know who you are . WARREN HARRIS: And I think you will , and this is because there is, I think, a sense of enthusiasm and a sense that we have some great opportunities before us, that it ' s also standing within the City. I 've heard Jack on many occasions we ' ve been in meetings , and we ' ve said there ' s a sense of synergy between even Economic Development and Planning that ' s probably not been there at the level that it ' s been in years past . So, that also extends within the working network within the city and the various departments that are helping, because we can ' t do it all . I mean, the work that ' s out there to sell the City is only as good as that site review planner getting that plan reviewed and moved through the process . So, we need to do a job of interconnecting those parts equally as important . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: If we could do that, we ' d really get even a bigger bang for all of our citizens , bringing economic development here, as well . WARREN HARRIS: Yes , ma ' am. COUNCIL LADY HARRIS : But thank you . You 've brought a lot of excitement to the department . WARREN HARRIS : We ' ve got a lot to be thankful for in the City. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And we ' re really glad to have you. 13 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, in addition to that, Mr . Harris has already been embraced as a Member of the Court of King Neptune. WARREN HARRIS : I have to grow a beard, though. MAYOR OBERNDORF: But seriously, as you know, King Neptune is generally a leader in the business community, and his friends are leaders and that puts Warren right in the headlights so that he has access on a very informal basis to be able to get them to know him better to recommend. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: We were in the presence of the King this morning. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Oh, good. Mr . Villanueva, then Mr . Jones? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Thank you, Mayor . Warren, I 'm looking at the "Requested but not Funded" list . On here, you ' ve got 150K for travel; is that on top of the existing travel budget? And looking at this, a lot of times it would be helpful for us to find out where you were targeting towards , because folks around the table, now, I travel all the time, and there ' s that old adage "it takes money to make money" , and in order for you to get these prospects and close the deal, you 've got to travel to these prospects . WARREN HARRIS : It ' s face time . You can ' t depend on a letter, that ' s right, or phone any more . I think that ' s the level of upgrade we ' d like to see in terms of putting Virginia Beach in front of the decision maker face to face . The markets, we ' re going to be in Europe; that ' s important just because of the exchange, the currency exchange . I mean, the Euro is now going to go much farther, obviously, in the U. S . , and as a result, and we are talking with European-based companies that are looking to invest in Virginia Beach because not only will that dollar go further but they are now understanding the strategy that you need to be close to the customer . We, as consumers, we are in a just-in-time delivery mentality. We cannot wait . Those European-based companies know that they need to be here close to the customer . They also know if they 14 want to do business with U. S . companies, particularly defense related or homeland security related, they have to have a U. S . base . So, there ' s going to be that interest from European-based companies to also base their operations here in the U. S . , hopefully here in Virginia Beach, because they want to also participate in many of those contracts and awards that are coming out . In terms of our travel budget, specifically, in that regard I ' ll lets Mrs . Spanoulis speak to that . CYNTHIA SPANOULIS: It was, basically, it was a whole package . It included travel, it included marketing materials in a variety of languages, ads in a variety of International publications , so when Warren would be in, say, Japan or another foreign country, we could do an introductory piece saying he ' s here, etcetera, etcetera . So, it was the $150, 000 was a package deal that included travel but also a lot of marketing materials , and that was not funded. COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Thanks . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Harris? WARREN HARRIS: One of the things -- excuse me, Madam Mayor -- that really is impressive, I think the City has done with these is when we go overseas it ' s great if we can go over there as a host to an event . I think we ' ve hosted some events here specifically around Stihl and in Germany, and that works effectively because it allows us to leverage the business that has the relationship with the City and serving as a magnet for introductions to other business decision makers . So, a lot of the global initiative also looked at us being able to host special events . They don ' t have to be large, elaborate, receptions , but they have to be event oriented that can be the magnet to attract others by virtue of that hosting to also hear the Virginia Beach message face to face . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Jones? VICE-MAYOR JONES: I don ' t have a question, Madam Mayor . I just have a comment . Mrs . Wilson touched on it a minute ago, but I would like to reiterate it . And that is that Warren has brought a new sense of energy and excitement to the Economic Development Department, City of Virginia Beach. You can tell by the initiatives that he ' s creating that he has a great deal of imagination and energy. I just want to thank you for what you ' re doing, Warren . 15 WARREN HARRIS: I appreciate that . Thank you very much. We have a great team and we ' re going to continue to work hard at it . So, it ' s a collective effort, for sure . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you very much. WARREN HARRIS: Thank you. (Whereupon, the discussion of this topic was concluded. ) 9 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN 3:58P.M. Jack Whitney, Director — Planning, provided the attached presentation regarding an update of the Strategic Growth Areas, which is attached and made a part of these proceedings, along with the Verbatim Transcript. April 15, 2008 =1011111111. M.111111111111, AIP d111111111111111111111111P -----.40 -a—"I =11$ A. 74: -711 CA AP (Ise = cr ...........,„ ar g:4 „r"yr.e• Awn.. CI) .., arifiraisp -.,I-v-mrif. °NI ..........ai gt:1 . = mil. •••• Cie © 44 t, 71 4 z cct (NI -4-0 ....„„...„. tz = Po •-• ...,, 0 rzo 14 4 o.) dIIII d1111111111111111, •_ 4. 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C - c,, O • .A... c,, c) a 1 VIRGINIA BEACH CITY COUNCIL April 15 , 2008 3 : 58 p .m. CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN RE: STRATEGIC GROWTH AREAS UPDATE VERBATIM CITY COUNCIL Meyera E. Oberndorf, Mayor At-Large Louis R. Jones, Vice-Mayor Bayside - District 4 William R. DeSteph At-Large Harry E . Diezel Kempsville - District 2 Robert M. Dyer Centerville - District 1 Barbara M. Henley Princess Anne - District 7 Reba S . McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E. Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L. Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS, CMC 2 CITY MANAGER: Jack Whitney is here to talk a little bit about Strategic Growth Areas . It ' s one of the few new initiatives in the budget, and in my personal opinion and professional opinion it ' s going to be key to the next ten years of activity in the City of Virginia Beach. If we don ' t do a good job on this, we ' re going to have some issues . JACK WHITNEY: Thank you, Jim. I couldn ' t agree more . Warren ' s presentation was a nice segue into the issue of Strategic Growth Areas and the expanded and very important role that they are going to play in the shaping of our community in the future . As Mr . Spore mentioned, in the budget that you have before you there is a very groundbreaking, unique, and strategic recommendation. That has to do with investing in the implementation of our Strategic Growth Area Planning efforts that are currently underway. That investment will occur, should the Council approve it , through Capital Improvement Program $3 million per year over the next six years, and then the Operating Budget, the proposal is in this budget cycle, $500, 000 . Mr . DeSteph asked a little bit about that , and I have a slide coming up later in the presentation which I hope will be on point . First of all, the Strategic Growth Areas , you will recall, are part of the Comprehensive Plan. They were conceived in the 2003 Comprehensive Plan as being those areas that have been identified throughout the community intended to absorb a lot of our future growth, primarily in the nature of redevelopment . There are 12 of them, 13 , including now the Oceanfront , and they are, as I say, representing a diverse cluster of attractive and compatible land use and mixed uses in potential . They offer us a great opportunity for alternative transportation systems planning. They can help accomplish objectives, in terms of Workforce Housing, minimizing sprawl , protecting residential areas, environmental impact, and, also, as Warren alluded to, really fit hand-in-hand with our Economic Development strategy. And it is true, I 'm happy to say, that over the past year or so our two departments have been working closer in a more integrated, not only project-by-project fashion, but planning fashion than I 've ever experienced in my work in the City up until now. It ' s very exciting . We ' ve got a great team and it ' s a thrill to be part of it . What are they? Where are they? Again, this is something that we have been working on in the Economic Vitality Strategic 3 Issues Team for at least 18 months , if not longer . Beginning a lot from our investment, the great work that Media and Communications and others did in Public Voices on Redevelopment, you recall that program, that award-winning program, that really challenged us to take our community involvement efforts as part of our Planning and Economic Development efforts to the next level . We ' re building upon that initiative . We are also building upon the work that Economic Vitality and others concentrated on about 18 months ago in what we called "Shaping our Community" , developing a program that is much more detailed, planning and urban-design oriented, much more detailed and sincere, in terms of engaging the community, and, importantly, focused upon implementation. Good plans are good, but good plans are better if they actually are implemented. The investment we ' re here to talk about with you this afternoon and in the future is focused on that investment, the return on that investment , our ability to take plans and take the visions that you and our community develop, convert them into plans that really mean something, that expectations about it actually happening can be fulfilled, and that ' s what we ' re talking about . Again, these are the Strategic Growth Areas there in red and enumerated on the right-hand side, and they are by and large aligned along our major transportation corridor, the 264/Virginia Beach Boulevard corridor, and rimming NAS Oceana in areas to the west and south of Naval Air Station Oceana. And then you ' ll see Burton Station, we call it Northampton, and then the little smaller one over by the City of Chesapeake, which is actually the CBN property. That ' s how they are geographically. We will be looking at those, again. The prior Comprehensive Plan, we ' ve identified a far higher role for those areas than was envisioned in 2003 . A lot has happened since then, making the Strategic Growth Areas even more strategic and more opportunistic . BRAC has occurred. That has had a profound impact on the way we look at land use planning in our community. Workforce Housing, the obvious challenge, the very serious challenge that this community and others throughout the Commonwealth are facing with respect to our ability to balance growth and development with a healthy transportation system, multi-modal transportation system, and our challenge to balance the two, managing the gap between when impacts are identified and our ability to satisfy them with capacity, creative and efficient transportation systems . Some of the work that ' s been done to date, we have been to you on a number of occasions recently talking about these efforts, again, going back to Public Voices on Redevelopment, through 4 Shaping our Community to a lot of the work that ' s underway right now in the three first Strategic Growth Areas that we are applying these principles and these visions to, and I ' ll get to that a little bit more in a minute . We briefed you last summer . We also briefed the Planning Commission, the Board of Zoning Appeals, and the Virginia Beach Development Authority late last year . We made a presentation to the Blue Ribbon Committee . I think that was very interesting. We got a lot of ideas and suggestions emanating from that effort . Working with you, we selected three Strategic Growth Areas to get started with. It ' s our intention to develop detailed plans and public processes and implementation strategies on three Strategic Growth Areas per year . We have started, our very first one was out at the Oceanfront, we started last fall . We retained the services of Sasaki and Associates . We conducted two sets of two-day Planning and Design Charrettes, which were very well-attended. It ' s a testament, I believe, to how successful they were . The second group of those design charrettes was larger and had more participation than the first . So, the word got around, I believe, that it meant something, that it was a worthwhile investment of time, and I 'm real excited about it . We will be coming back to the community with follow-ups on that in mid-may and then hopefully shortly thereafter back to you with a briefing on the outcome of that effort . The Council saw fit to invest $300 , 000 in this year ' s budget to conduct that work. We ' re very excited with what ' s happened so far . We ' ve had tremendously positive feedback from the participants in the community, and we look forward to coming back to you with the results of that effort . They generally take about six months . This process, the way it ' s designed and applied in the individual SGA' s, we think it will take, to do it right, we think it will take about four to six months in each SGA. Right now, as you ' re well aware, about two weeks ago we kicked off the same kind of approach in Burton Station. We had two very active days of meetings with the property owners, very extensive outreach to the property owners and interested parties to bring them into the process , have them engaged, and believe in what was going on, and I think we accomplished that . In that particular SGA, we were fortunate to have Urban Design Associates and Landmark Design, a local firm, helping us with that effort . We will be coming back to Burton Station for follow-ups to the first round of design charrettes later this month. Each SGA, as you can well imagine, has its own unique set of challenges and opportunities . We think we 've got an approach that ' s custom tailored to each of them. So far, it ' s been 5 working real well , I 'm happy to say, and in much greater detail than any of these communities have seen in the past, with respect to not only the planning that ' s done in the Comprehensive Plan but Economic Development programs and strategies and our ability to review in a meaningful comprehensive way individual Rezoning Applications, Use Permits, and so forth, that come in. It gives us a much tighter, more credible context within which to develop our recommendations on individual land use actions ; that ' s a key thing . We ' re right now working on a scope of services for the Pembroke SGA, and we hope to be able to kick that effort off in early summer . And if all things stay to schedule, we will have these first three SGA' s completed, ready to present to you, and incorporated into the Comprehensive Plan by the end of the year . We updated another update for the Development Authority. Again, I 've been spending an awful lot of time with my friend, Warren, over the past few months and enjoy every bit of it . We updated you on the status, the interim status , of the work in the Resort Area in January. Again, we ' ll be back to you in a month or so, once we finish the next set of meetings there . Again, we ' ve had the charrettes in Burton Station. We will do the next round of follow-up later this month and early May. What ' s the implementation process? Obviously, we are coordinating these efforts with the Comprehensive Plan process which is underway right now, and we ' re on schedule to complete that work and have that back to you with the results of these efforts . You 've already seen the APZ-1 Master Plans, which you ' ve incorporated in the Comprehensive Plan by reference, and we hope to have the Comprehensive Plan getting into that public involvement process later this summer, fall, and about this time next year or summer of ' 09 we think that effort will be reaching conclusion . It ' s an interdepartmental approach. Warren mentioned it . I believe that it ' s true that we now have a much tighter and stronger working relationship with Economic Development, with the Operating Departments, with the Law Department, and everybody else under this new model of cooperation, planning, and implementation, and that is really exciting . Our Strategic Issue Teams are largely responsible for providing the framework within which that happens . This effort is largely done through the Economic Vitality SIT, and the various SIT ' s have just been terrific in bringing departments together on strategic issues facing the community and fostering this interdepartmental cooperation that I mentioned. 6 I have to thank, Mary is not here, I wish she were, to hear this, the efforts that Mary and her staff have brought to the process in terms of developing very real, we call them, Public Listening Opportunities, not Public Hearing; it ' s not just us going, sitting at a dais, and having testimony. It ' s much more organic and engaged process . We call it Public Listening. It ' s a whole different way of conducting our business in the community, and we ' re happy with how that ' s developed. The feedback we get has been very positive, even in difficult situations . We use a team for each SGA with a specific focus . Again, every SGA is different, and we want to make sure we provide the most custom-tailored teamed approach to the issues there . Again, I mentioned the request that ' s in your budget right now to help move this process forward with resources both in the CIP, $3 million per year over the life of the Six-Year CIP and $500, 000 in the Operating Budget situated in the Economic Development Department ' s proposed budget . Parallel work, none of this happens in a vacuum, nor should it . I mentioned the Comprehensive Plan. We 've also worked with and engaged input for the Green Ribbon Committee, we ' re seeing more and more, and we ' re proactively getting more and more green-oriented development, not only in the architecture, but in the planning of projects in these areas . And the Green Ribbon Committee and the timing of that effort has been quite fortuitous in helping us with this overall approach. Workforce Housing, we 've been working with Andy Friedman and the CDC and others on ways to integrate our Workforce Housing goals into these efforts . You will recall that your Ordinance a year or so ago implementing the Workforce Housing program specifically mentioned the role that the SGA ' s can play in accommodating our Workforce Housing developments in the future . The Blue Ribbon Committee, I mentioned to you earlier that we have briefed that committee, listened to what they had to say, shared our observations with them and have incorporated suggestions that they have made, communicated to us, in the approach we ' re presenting to you. Obviously, just recently, in recent weeks we have completed what I thought was a very successful effort to develop Master Plans for the APZ-1 and Clear Zone areas . You have heard very positive comments coming out of the community that participated in those efforts, and they have now been incorporated into the Comprehensive Plan. What are some of the products? Obviously, each SGA will have a detailed Master Plan. It will be very graphic in nature, 7 very user-friendly, very easy to understand and relate to . We will have community involvement plans for each and every one that we 've been developing. I mentioned a little bit about that a few minutes ago . Design Guidelines , Pattern Books, we have found that Zoning Ordinances and Comprehensive Plans aren' t quite enough. What do they mean? What do they look like? When you apply those Ordinances and plans to the ground, what ' s the result going to look like? How do we deal with infill in existing neighborhoods in a manner which is consistent and complementary to what is there and not confusing and incompatible? Pattern Books are a way of doing that, a way of illustrating the vision incorporated into the other plans and Zoning techniques and so forth that we have, and we 've found those to be very successful . We ' ve got Design Guidelines , for example, in Princess Anne Commons , which are returning dividends every day. Proposed developments in there see our quality expectations , they know that if they design to a quality standard so will the developments around them, and that will protect their investment and result in a very coordinated overall pattern. Zoning Maps and Overlay Districts, you 've heard me say this before, we want to take a more proactive approach. You don ' t just zone it and hope for the best . We call it "aspirational zoning" . We want to make sure that our Zoning Ordinances are proactive, aspirational, and help us accomplish what we want . In the old days around the country, zoning was a way to prevent bad stuff from happening . It can also be a way to encourage and incentivise good land use design and planning, and that ' s what we ' re focusing on; much more proactive than reactive approach. This effort will help us do that . Obviously, Economic Development and Marketing Plans are very well-tied to this . When Jim Ricketts or Warren Harris or others are out in the community talking to prospective investors or out in the world talking to prospective investors, these will be real tools that will demonstrate the vision that this Council and this community has as a way to attract the kind of economic development and investment that we think is there for us, taking it to another level . The "Team" , I mentioned team work, Steve Herbert and I and Warren and others have worked very closely together, and the SGA Planning Teams will be interdisciplinary, interdepartmental , custom tailored to the needs, as I say, of that particular SGA. The relative emphasis of some of the departments in functional areas of the City will vary according to those needs . But the core team will include 8 representation from all of these departments , again, in a new, relatively unprecedented, fashion in Virginia Beach. What ' s the Work Plan? I mentioned to you that we have taken on a very aggressive approach in the SGA' s to deal with three per year . We ' re well underway with the first three in this year . We ' ve established the SGA teams . We 've established a schedule, which I mentioned to you earlier . We 've kicked off the efforts in the Resort area, in Northampton, Burton Station, and we ' re on the verge of doing the same thing in Pembroke . Later this year, we will come back to you with a prioritized schedule for the next three that we will be embarking upon in Year 2 . And the resources that we are recommending that you and the community invest for that purpose will optimize the use of in-house resources . Again, they will include a $500, 000 infusion in the upcoming Operating Budget . And this is my slide for Mr . DeSteph and others, that $500, 000 -- MAYOR OBERNDORF: We ' ll take a mental snapshot for him. JACK WHITNEY: I ' ll reiterate it when he comes back, if necessary. That money, that operating money, will be used to develop the design plans, acquire, if necessary, specialized consulting services , expertise in developing and predicting the return of the investment that we ' re getting ready to make, and these Public Listening/Community Involvement efforts are resource intensive, not only the staff working very hard proactively to engage the community to inform them via the media, personal phone calls, personal letters , coordination with civic organizations and others, that would be also part of this expenditure . The CIP Request, $3 million per year over the next six years of the current CIP, will be invested in such areas of land and right-of-way acquisition where necessary, infrastructure improvements . These Strategic Growth Areas by and large have infrastructure, but it may be an aging infrastructure, and it may not be sized or located in a manner which will stimulate and support efficient land use . So, part of the investment here through the CIP will be dealing with upgrading, expanding, and sizing and matching our infrastructure with our plans . Relocation costs, if it ' s necessary or desired in some of these Strategic Growth Areas, to involve relocation, some of the money for that relocation and the development of the relocation plans will come out of this fund. Again, all intended for costs associated with the implementation of the plans that you in the community support . 9 What, then, are the next steps? The Resort Area Master Plan Adoption, again, we hope to come back with you when it ' s right, when it ' s time, when it ' s ready for prime time, with the Resort Area Master Plan probably in June, maybe July, but it will be right when it comes back to you . Pembroke Master Plan -- well , Burton Station I talked to you about where that schedule is in the next steps, late this month we ' ll go back into that community and talk some more, listen some more, and display the results of the input we receive . Pembroke, again, we hope to kick off in early summer . We will be reviewing with you annually, getting input on what the next year ' s three priority Strategic Growth Areas will be, and then we ' ll set a schedule and time frame to accomplish those . Again, the budget adoption is critical to what we ' re proposing to do . And with that, I ' ll be happy to answer any questions you might have regarding this . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Mr . Villanueva, and then Mr . Dyer? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Thanks, Mayor . Jack, a lot, you know, for the past several years, we know Town Center is a vibrant part of our City, and there ' s one particular CIP project that hasn ' t been thoroughly articulated by Council and staff with regards to the importance of it; that ' s the Pedestrian Bridge, and a lot of folks understand that on the other side there ' s going to be significant investment, and I was just hoping you could talk a little bit about that so that the public can be aware about why this CIP project is important . JACK WHITNEY: Mr. Villanueva, I think this goes back to a point I tried to make a little bit earlier . All too often these projects are seen in isolation. They' re seen individually and not within a context . What does it mean in terms of the overall area, overall economic development, overall circulation, infrastructure? And these plans , I believe, will help communicate how these individual projects fit in to the bigger picture, and they will be developed as part of a process that encourages that kind of thing and that we believe will give you and others more confidence that the community understands how these projects play out in their role in the overall design. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. Mr. DeSteph? 10 VICE-MAYOR JONES : I think Steven wanted to speak. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Herbert? STEVEN HERBERT: Yes, Ma ' am. I got to answer that question the other day in a Member meeting, and it was the only question non-jointly answered, so I want to take this opportunity. We are very much committed with this SGA process . This is a fascinating process . The early work we found with the Resort and Burton Station, I think, you ' re going to be very pleased and proud of the results when we come back. It will be a blueprint for some great future development for the City. That particular bridge, as I reported the other day, is , I think, in the CIP it ' s about three years out, I believe. It is that connection, as you know, from the existing Town Center over to what we hope will be the next, one of, if not the next, very soon next phases of Town Center ' s future development . It ' s in there to, as we explain to people, so far the easiest part of the growth strategy, prosperity strategy, for Town Center . There ' s also a Public Safety aspect of it; crossing Virginia Beach Boulevard may be thrilling, but it ' s not safe right now for people . So, that ' s in there . We know its outcome and its fate depends on what you do later in May, but it is a CIP project . It ' s really not in your Operating Budget, and it ' s in 2011 , I think. MAYOR OBERNDORF: But if we ' re worried about safety, until we have the money ready to build it or at least half of it, why don ' t we look at putting up the wrought iron decorative fencing so that you can only cross at the corners in a crosswalk with the appropriate lighting so if you want to roll somebody across in a stroller, a baby or an adult who has to use a wheelchair, you at least have a fighting chance to be able to enjoy both sides of Virginia Beach Boulevard until the latest , I guess, 2011 , when the elevated crosswalk will be complete? I wouldn ' t think the ground treatment, like you see in some beautiful boulevards all over this country where people cannot cut across, they have to go to the corners and go through the crosswalks, which would make it at least temporarily much more reasonable until we can get the crossover and make sure the lights are coordinated. Mr . Spore and I discussed this recently, the minute you put your foot in the crosswalk, it ' s already saying you ' re out of time, or something, and you ' re like "oh, my God, I 'm going to be flattened before I ever make it to the other side" . But I 'm sure with the brilliant engineers we have, somebody will figure out the timing on 11 that . I understand it ' s meant not to have others attempt to cross during the cycle that it ' s unsafe, but I bet you we can find a resolution for that . JACK WHITNEY: One of the things that we get from these Public Listening opportunities , not only just expressions of what sort of land use do you want to see or not want to see, but we hear expressions of other community issues, as well ; safety, being one . And we hear expressions of safety issues expressed differently than we might think of safety issues, and it ' s really of value to learn how the community views and identifies certain safety issues as contrasted to how we might, as Planners, Public Safety Officials, or Engineers , identify the very same thing. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I noticed in the CIP page it says that new funding for the Pedestrian Bridge is contingent upon the finalization of a public/private agreement; that is the agreement for development, not a TIF project, it ' s another? CITY MANAGER: Yes . And we have been discussing with the property owners on the north side of the boulevard the expectations for additional investment on their part and where this bridge would terminate and who would participate in various phases of it . The goal is to try and put that into a master agreement . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: This would be primarily -- well , with both sides , then, or the other side, the developing side over on the Pembroke Mall side, primarily? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Both sides , we hope, will be . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: But, I mean, this future public/private agreement that this is contingent on that this refers to, then, is looking toward the development on the other side . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Dyer? And I apologize . COUNCILMAN DYER: Thank you. Not a problem at all , Madam Mayor . This is indeed a worthy initiative, but I would be remiss if I didn ' t bring up a concern. One of the major red flags that the Blue Ribbon Task Force identified was the lack of a really functional Strategic Plan citywide that everybody can look at 12 and see a good blueprint of what we ' re doing, why we ' re doing it, how we ' re going to do it, and things of that nature. And my concern is , without this, and once again this is a good initiative, I have to be able to give assurances to people in my District, I 'm sure everybody else does , that we ' re not going to fall through the cracks, in terms of certain things in funding . You know, I have to tell my folks that we can ' t fund punching Lynnhaven through the Centerville Turnpike, but then they' re going to be seeing developments in another area . And my hope is that we go forward with the upcoming Retreat that we ' re going to be having, that we really give a lot of thought about really putting together a plan that we could have for the people to see and stuff on the website that is really coherent and understand what we ' re doing and why we ' re doing it . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you. Anyone else wish to say something? Mr . DeSteph? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: On the Strategic Growth Areas , I think one of the things to follow along with what Bob was just saying, is I think we still need to see the Strategic Plan, itself, that the Strategic Growth Areas, I believe, are a subset of . As the Blue Ribbon Task Force recommended, we need a Strategic Plan. So, it would be very good to see that . On the crossover for Virginia Beach Boulevard there, I think we need to look at how many people would use that and return on investment, and then look at other cities, such as Washington, D. C . , New York, which have Constitution Avenue, similar in size as Virginia Beach Boulevard, and hundreds of thousands of people cross that all the time, so the light timing issue may resolve that issue . I think there may be other alternatives we need to look at , as well . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Did someone get hurt crossing that street? COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: By the Museum, there were a couple of bicycles that were hit, but as far as I know not on Virginia Beach Boulevard, by the Aquarium. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: No, I was thinking about on Virginia Beach Boulevard; has anyone been hurt? MAYOR OBERNDORF: I don ' t remember it being reported, if it happened. 13 CITY MANAGER: There have been a couple, but not serious injuries, fortunately. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: I did have a very good friend whose 40-year-old son was killed in Washington, D .C . , crossing the street . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, I wasn ' t saying that ' s a solution. I was just saying, looking at Richmond, looking at different cities, you made me think about it when you talked about getting people on their feet when you went to Arlington, that they were encouraging you to walk around and see. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Well, they've got their lights timed so that they can get -- MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: -- and they have a center median so that people can get there, and they have a safety spot . COUNCILMAN DESTEPH: Not on Constitution Avenue . It ' s 8 to 10 lanes wide, and it ' s straight across, but the timing is better than ours . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: No, I 'm talking about Arlington, my trip to Arlington last week. They 've done away with pedestrian crosswalks . They want people on the street where the retail is so that they can walk and shop and look and -- MAYOR OBERNDORF: Spend money. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: -- spend money. And the other thing they ' ve done is they 've put medians in so that there ' s a place they can stop in-between and have a safety zone as they ' re crossing the street . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Any other questions or observations? Jack, I ' ve been to some of your listenings, and it really is a phenomenal process , sitting at a roundtable with people you don ' t know when you walk in, listening to their ideas and having it compiled afterwards in a long recommendation from the public that we can work with. I know I came late, but I was at the one down at the Ocean Front, and everybody took their time before they left to come up and tell me what they personally thought, and it was a 14 positive situation, and your staff is pretty terrific , too . JACK WHITNEY: Indeed, they are . MAYOR OBERNDORF: They' re charming, they ' re patient, and they encourage people not to just get frustrated and not articulate what they' re thinking. They have a way of bringing everybody into the conversation. It makes a world of difference . JACK WHITNEY: It ' s been very gratifying. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Thank you . JACK WHITNEY: Mayor, Council Members , thank you for your attention. (Whereupon, the discussion of this matter was concluded. ) 10 CITY COUNCIL'S BRIEFINGS PROPOSED BIENNIAL RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN FY 2008-2009 AND 2009-2010 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN 4:37P.M. Lynn Clements, Director — Museums, provided the attached presentation regarding Historic Preservations, which is attached and made a part of these proceedings, along with the Verbatim Transcript. April 15, 2008 0 w oo 'C d ,__, M O ,_, rn 0 y Ti N .--i - t 00 00 00 O N rn S N g y m o , 0 N M D, \O d p ODIT a o n O C2. '-i vi 01 1 O1 00 p N- O- m 3 3 N O © a. 00 V) N •-- rnrn �d N m C a 0 c c m 6R fA FH 64 69 00 &9 64 m' _ ` E2' g Oo m - N V r Q2 ii._ _I <0) = 0C 41 Q1 E8 ® ❑ ❑ ■ 0 U Z.- M \.. m F d O r) O M O n. 00 N O, N •--1 d' CT N O O N v) O, p N O Q. O1 M 00 N 00 o 00 O N. N 0 O\ O1 00 N V7 N •'-1 N 69 69 EA 60 69 00 69 bR all) .............„.........,.„......................,...,. . N d N C _ N t� O O ■ ,,,zz ;:..::::. ♦ ..... ..... 00 00 O ON N O N lit r.;:y N �� N N 00 N . ..... 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CD � p �� p L II IMMO I— • L L CI o m U = a) oo —' I..L N •- '� * N Q W CO �' o �m o < a co — E— ° a) •opo •c }- � _, oow Q. 1- < < i_ u) 2 to Li_ RS e H Q ,cal U? u) a �- CL C') g i J CO C') i i M I i LU cn • • 1 VIRGINIA BEACH CITY COUNCIL April 15 , 2008 4 : 37 p .m. RESOURCE MANAGEMENT PLAN WORKSHOP CITY MANAGER' S BRIEFING RE : HISTORIC PRESERVATION VERBATIM CITY COUNCIL Meyera E . Oberndorf, Mayor At-Large Louis R. Jones, Vice-Mayor Bayside - District 4 William R. DeSteph At-Large Harry E . Diezel Kempsville - District 2 Robert M. Dyer Centerville - District 1 Barbara M. Henley Princess Anne - District 7 Reba S . McClanan Rose Hall - District 3 John E . Uhrin Beach - District 6 Ronald A. Villanueva At-Large Rosemary Wilson At-Large James L. Wood Lynnhaven - District 5 CITY MANAGER: James K. Spore CITY ATTORNEY: Leslie L. Lilley CITY CLERK: Ruth Hodges Fraser, MMC DEPUTY CITY CLERK SARAH DEAL JENKINS 2 CITY MANAGER: For those that are watching at home, this is Lynn Clements and Mark Reed that are going to talk about the City ' s effort and budget toward Historic Preservation. LYNN CLEMENTS: Well , I 'm the Director of the Department of Museums , and that includes the Aquarium, but today we ' re talking about Historic Properties , and so Mark and I are going to present today. We ' re fortunate to have Mark on staff . He ' s our Resources Coordinator, and he ' ll be doing part of the presentation, as well . I just wanted to do a quick overview. I 'm really jazzed, I was trying to think of a good word to use, Jazzed is good, that people are talking about Historic issues in Virginia Beach. So, that ' s good news, and I think it stems from the fact that we had such a great year last year with VB 2007 . The community is involved and we hope that more people will be involved by being volunteers and helping us with our Friends groups and renting out facilities and there ' s lots of opportunity in Historic Preservation and Historic Sites Museums . If you ' ve never visited our facilities , next week is Historic Garden Week, and if you buy a ticket to go to the private homes you can also come to six of our Historic Homes and see them, as well . So, enough for my commercial on tax day. I ' ll go on with our little presentation here . Our proposed budget provides funding for the operations of three Historic House Museums, the Adam Thoroughgood House, the Francis Land House, and the Lynnhaven House . And that includes administrative, curatorial , and business support for the three museums , and administrative support for some Historic Preservation items . The Historic House Museums contribute to the quality of life in Virginia Beach and are positive elements in attracting new residents and businesses . They are divisions of Department of Museums and we received a 94% satisfaction rating in the 2007 Citizen Survey. The Property Staff, the Historic Property Staff, seek to administer and operate their three houses to the highest professional museum standards and to be excellent stewards of these significant Historic buildings . In FY-07 , we developed a disaster plan for each site, and it was one of the objectives, we worked together in a group called "Cultural and Recreational Opportunities Strategic Issue Team" , we planned with other City Departments , and they asked that we come up with a plan for what would happen if we had a disaster with one of our Historic structures . So, we 3 learned from our work at the Isle of Wight County Museum. They had a flood. Some of our staff went there . We helped them, and we actually learned about how to create a plan from a real experience . Very soon, the Lynnhaven House property will transfer to City ownership, and inspections are underway for closing the permits for the Colonial Education Center Building, and with the issuance of a Certificate of Occupancy the City will go to closing on the property. This new facility offers many opportunities for us to serve the community in the next fiscal year . The three houses need a governing body to assist the staff in the process of strategic planning and interpretive planning and in promoting community support for the sites . The Historic Sites Organizing Committee recommended to Council in April of last year that a private foundation would be the best structure for governance . This is in the process of being formed. They also recommended that a Commission be formed, like the successful Arts and Humanities Commission to set the course for Historic Preservation in the City. So, I 've just given you an overview. What we ' d like to do is look at the budget now, and Mark really deals with this on a day-to-day basis, so he ' s going to talk with you about the Operating Budget and the CIP . MARK REED: Thank you, Lynn. Good afternoon, Madam Mayor, Members of Council . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Good afternoon. MARK REED: The upcoming budget in FY-09 and FY-10 is going to allow us to pretty much continue the services we ' ve been providing to the public over the last two years . We have three house museums that are open six days per week. We ' ll be able to continue that . Two of our museums are open 46 hours , the Thoroughgood House and the Francis Land House, and the Lynnhaven House is open 34 hours a week. All of that we should be able to continue with the current budget . The primary impact on the operation of the three sites of our current budget is probably a small reduction in the Special Interpreter Programs that we do . That ' s the one area we have the most flexibility and probably just a reduction in number or scale, just a very light effect, we think. In the current budget, we have made a change to how our money is put together . We 've created an administrative budget unit 4 where we can put all of the staff together that works for all three of the houses and the various operating costs that are related to all three of the houses in one budget unit, and that provides a fairly equal budget for each of the three operations . In effect, the main difference in the dollars for each of those three is in the staffing, either the number of part-time hours that they have, or in some cases simply the seniority of a full-time staff person there . The operating budget, the actual money that they have, the Site Managers have to expend on their operations in FY-09 is going to be exactly the same for all three sites; $17 , 426 is the discretionary money they' ll have for the expenditures for that 12-month period. We also have some pass-through money that we administer for the Old Coast Guard Station and the Atlantic Wildfowl Guild, Atlantic Wildfowl Museum and DeWitt Cottage. As with any budget, we either have provided with the increase in target or the decrease in target for those line items , and in this case it is a decrease of the 6% . So, each of them will have a reduction of the dollars coming to them by that 6% amount . There is one line item that no longer needs to be funded. It ' s an annuity for the DeWitt Cottage. It was part of the arrangement when the DeWitt Cottage was being purchased by the City of Virginia Beach, and there ' s no need for funding in 2009 or in the future for that , the $87 , 500; that ' s been funded since 1990 . With Historic Preservation, we did make a proposed reduction here based upon requests from Management Services for us to provide them with a programmatic reduction from our department . We 've proposed reduction of about $13 , 500 for the Historic Register Program. We feel that there ' s a couple of reasons that that works out for us, as far as a reduction is concerned. One, it has no impact on our revenues coming into the City; there ' s no revenues coming in from that program. And second, we have on hand the plaques and certificates to be able to maintain that program for this two-year period of time and hope that when we get into FY-11 we can get that funding back, but we felt it has the least impact of anything that we could offer . We do feel that the reduction of programming at each of the sites is going to be offset by a fee increase . We ' re increasing our admission fee by a dollar a person across the board, so adult goes from $4 to $5 , senior $3 to $4 , students $2 to $3 , and that would more than, we think, cover any reductions that we might have of revenue coming in. And we also feel that the opening of the Colonial Education Center at 5 the Lynnhaven House is going to attract many more people to that site so that we shouldn ' t see any reduction in the revenues that we typically earn. The three sites typically serve about 25 , 000 people per year . Almost half school children coming for field trips or us going into the classroom versus the people who come for tours and for special events . The schools, we have seen a trend over the last five years or so, we ' re getting fewer and fewer students; the combination of the SQL ' s, where they used to be filled every day in May, and May is SOL month for all the schools . That from the schools, as well as the cost of gas and the fewer field trips going out, have given us some impact over the last two years . It ' s starting to level out a little bit, but about 25 , 000 people per year we ' re serving through our programs . For our revenues, we ' re taking in about $75 , 000 annually; that ' s through the admissions, as well as the Museum store sales , about $3 per person. During the past year, we had over 6 , 500 hours, volunteer hours, donated to the three sites , and that has helped us immensely in our offering of services to the public . And for the Historical Register, with two sites out of this current year, we now have 43 sites on the local register . We ' re very excited that there ' s a CIP project that is currently in the budget, the Heritage Building Maintenance Program. This is really very necessary for us . It provides a dedicated account for maintenance for the City ' s Historic buildings . In the past, we 've had to compete with all of the other facilities, and the Historic Sites often have needs typically that are a bit more expensive, require some certain expertise that normal contractors won ' t have, so we ' re real pleased this is proposed in the budget . It was based upon a study that is being done here in FY-08 . We had a chance to get enough information before we needed to submit the request for the CIP Program so that we feel that we have some pretty good numbers this is based on. And with that, the $900, 000 that ' s going to fund it over the course of four years beginning in FY-10 will still fall short of what we need by about $800 , 000 , so we ' re funding maybe half of our needs with this, but at least it ' s a good start for us . That study was based upon looking at five of the Historic buildings, the Thoroughgood, Lynnhaven, Land, Ferry Plantation, and Buffington Houses . With the Buffington House, it wasn ' t based upon renovation or making it public use or use for a City department, but instead to mothball it correctly, right now it ' s just boarded up, deteriorating every day, and 6 there are ways that you can store these building while you ' re deciding what to do with them so that they don ' t just fall apart on you . So, our funding in that study was based upon doing that correctly. Most likely, the way we ' re going to really need to stretch our funds in the next few years is to seek grants to help us do the work that we need on these houses . Couple examples are in process, two grant projects , both which have taken quite a while to get going, but I think in FY-09 we ' re going to see these finalized as far as all the work that ' s being done . They' re both Federal grants, one with the Ferry Plantation House . We have submitted a supplementary grant to do more work on the building . We should be hearing this week. The information from VDOT that we got was that the committee is going to meet on the 17th, and maybe on the 18th of this week we ' re going to hear whether or not we have received that grant . The Adam Thoroughgood House, the National Park Service is providing that funding; it ' s the Save America ' s Treasures Grant, and we ' re hopeful that we ' re going to have some instruction with that in the fall, as well . We do know we ' re far enough along, we do know we don ' t have enough funding with the current grant to do everything that ' s needed, so we ' re planning on submitting another grant request here in the next cycle which is coming up in May on May 20th. So, there are certainly ways to help us stretch this $900, 000 . It ' s the first time there ' s ever been a dedicated account for the Historic buildings with their unique needs . We ' re real happy that ' s something that ' s being started this year . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley, then Mrs . Wilson? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I thought I fairly well knew about what we were doing with the Historic Properties, but when I started asking questions the more I found more and more that I didn ' t know. And I had sent in a question yesterday, and I guess it ' s taken you a while to answer it, but just what is our policy and how did we get to where we are with the way we treat our different Historic Properties? And this is the problem, and you just handed us another brochure and it ' s three houses, and you keep talking about the three houses , anyone would think that we only have three Historic Properties . Actually, the City owns seven, but there are many, many, more in the city. This is the problem, we 've got the three that we are funding with operating costs and a lot of other things, and then the other four that the City 7 owns there are varying degrees of support, and I 'm not sure how each of those got to this level of support that they are . And this is the crux of the problem, I know we ' ve got the three that are owned and operated by the City, and then we have the four, but one of them is not operated at all . It ' s boarded up, as you said. We were not smart when we let the tenants go . I don ' t know why that happened. But the other three are operated by non-profits, and they get varying degrees of support . And so, I had asked really how much does each house get, because those figures that you show with operating costs don ' t include building maintenance, landscape maintenance, and other utilities . So, it gets to be a different figure . Then we have among the other three differing levels of support, and I just don ' t understand how we get there . And when we see the properties that are operated by the non-profits, and they continually see that they get less and less and then we keep adding more properties in that group that the City operates, there ' s a lot of frustration that ' s developing among those non-profit organizations because they just don ' t get any place . This really, I think, points it up when you look at the CIP . It looks like Ferry Plantation House is doing pretty well, but that $115 , 000 grant, of course, was awarded in 2003 . And that $30, 000 match was a part of the original money, and I 'm sorry he ' s not here, that Louis negotiated for the house when we got it back in 1997 . That was a part of that $68 , 500 that ' s been all the house has ever gotten for CIP property. And that $30 , 000 match was taken out of that CIP account about two days after the grant was awarded back in 2003 . So, they' ve done without any of the money for all that time while this $30 , 000 has been sitting there, waiting for some day when they may get the grant money. And it was kind of interesting when the Lynnhaven House came along with the ICTEA Grant, it said in our letter the in-kind match, the in-kind work will cover the match. Well , I 'm sure there ' s more than $30, 000 in-kind work that ' s been done over at Ferry, yet the money has been sitting in this sheltered CIP waiting for this grant . It was taken out of that, which was that original money that kind of bought the house to start with, in exchange for those two lots . And this is what is so discouraging for the non-profits and for people who are out there just working and working and working and trying to operate these other properties . And I, in talking with the folks from the other non-profits , this is just growing, this frustration. 8 I was interested in reading in the Executive Summary in a couple of places where it says the City Council has expressed interest in other programs, including a Bike and Trails Plan, acquiring and maintaining Historic Homes , and we have developed alternative funding strategies for each of these initiatives . So, I asked, what are those alternative funding strategies? And when I look at that and I look at the requested but not funded, I see things like purchasing Pleasant Hall, purchasing Pembroke Manor, purchasing other houses . And then I wonder, well, if we ' re going to be -- if someone thinks that that ' s our priority in Historic issues is purchasing more properties . And I wonder if they ' re going to get to be on the side of owned and operated by the City or if they will be non-profit . But then I see a requested but not funded amount of, I guess, $100, 000 for operating Pleasant Hall , if we had acquired it, so I 'm assuming that ' s going to be an operated so that the non-profits keep getting slipped back further . They don ' t ever seem to get any, because it ' s kind of interesting on this paper here, the Ferry Farm does get utilities . It gets $2 , 611 annually. That ' s in comparison to $140, 000 for Francis Land, Lynnhaven, $124 , 000, and Adam Thoroughgood, $125 , 000 . So, the Ferry Farm folks get $2 , 611 . Of course, the Atlantic Wildfowl Guild gets their contribution of $26 , 943 , but they do get some utilities and whatnot for $89 K and then the Coast Guard Museum gets $59 , 000 . And folks just don ' t understand, and I don ' t, how we ' ve gotten here, and the non-profits are wonderful and they want to continue operating. They want to continue doing that, but they just feel like they are continually competing. But I just say such things as when we ' re going to produce a brochure like this, why make it only on three Historic Properties? Why not include all of the Historic Properties in here? I mean, I wouldn ' t think it would cost that much more to be promoting all of the Historic Properties and helping everybody out a little bit . So, this is just the concern. I have been so frustrated over the Ferry issue for years and years . You know, when I see this and see that $30, 000 match, Louis, that ' s the money you got way back in ' 97 for them, and they haven ' t been able to use it for the last five years . VICE-MAYOR JONES : Got $80, 000 . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: $68 , 500, yes , and that was part of that, that $30, 000 match that they haven ' t been able to touch since 2003 . And that neighborhood of very, very, very expensive homes that surrounds that house, 9 I don ' t know why they haven ' t marched on City Hall , because they know that that house has been supposed to be fixed and they've been promised and promised and promised, and it hasn ' t . So, this is my frustration, and I guess my question, what do the non-profits do? What can they expect? Is it that the non-profits need to form a coalition of the non-profits to try to help each other, because they are slipping farther and farther and farther back? I understand that the folks at the Atlantic Wildfowl Museum are really, really struggling . I think they got a loan from the City and they ' re having difficulty paying it back. And they' re really, really, wondering how much longer they ' re going to be able to hold on over there . So, I mean, I think it ' s great that we ' re able to do what we ' re doing, but I look at this inequity and I think that these other hardworking non-profit volunteer groups who have put in thousands of hours and have put in thousands of their own pocket dollars in these properties deserve some attention. As far as the Buffington House, it was the Whitehurst House, I guess that it ' s probably the oldest property, you know, we 've got a Historic District here at the Courthouse, and I think that house is the oldest of the properties in this District, and the City owns it and it ' s sitting there boarded up . And, let ' s see, the expenditure for 2009 for that was $389 . And we have people who want to be the volunteer friends of the Whitehurst House, but we ' re not doing anything for that at all, and I know boarding up a house and letting it sit is about the worst thing you can do for it . So, I think we 've got some issues, and I still, you know, hearing you talk about how good that forum was or meeting with the Animal Control folks the other day and hearing these listening groups, I still think the first thing we ought to do is have a similar listening group that allows all of these groups to come together, and anyone interested in Historic Preservation express their concerns so we can have it all out there and know what we need to do. I 'm just sort of pleading for the non-profits here . And, of course, that doesn ' t even mention the Historical Society, which of course is totally non-profit, doesn ' t get any money, doesn ' t cost the City anything to operate Upper Wolfsnare, and doesn ' t cost the City anything to do advocacy and programming and has many volunteers who are very willing to go out and help do whatever needs to be done . And I just am sort of pleading their case because we just keep talking about three houses , three houses , three houses , and they say "what about us" ? You know we ' ve got some other really wonderful Historic 10 Properties, too, and they just kind of feel like they get left out . VICE-MAYOR JONES : Madam Mayor, may I? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Sure . VICE-MAYOR JONES : I 'm sorry. I apologize for being out of the room, Mark. Explain to me this $115 , 000 FHA and then the $30, 000 next to it? MARK REED: It ' s a TEA21 Grant that was awarded to Ferry Plantation for repair, restoration of their stucco, a reimbursement grant the City has created the CIP account in the amount of $145 , 000 and that gets reimbursed as the work goes forward. We run into a number of delays going forward with it, but we 've just sent off the first set of design drawings to the Virginia Department of Historic Resources for their project review, so it ' s finally moving forward hopefully to completion later this calendar year . VICE-MAYOR JONES : Thank you. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: And that $30 , 000 match came from that $68 , 500 that they had had all along. MARK REED: That ' s correct . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I mean, it ' s not new money by any stretch of the imagination. MARK REED: Well, we certainly don ' t want the three Historic House Museums that we operate to succeed at the expense of the other Historic Sites here . I think we, together, create a much greater, if I can use Mac Rawls ' favorite term, critical mass of Historic destinations and attractions and provide a lot of different opportunities for people to engage in the history of Virginia Beach. So, I think some strategic planning certainly needs to take place so that we can make sure that those other entities aren ' t left behind. I don ' t think that we want to push them out of the buildings they ' re in and have to either take them over or board them up or whatever would happen, so we want to move forward with hopefully trying to support the more we can . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, I have received letters from the DeWitt Cottage, and they are asking to be included in the budget this year because they are struggling, apparently, and not able to sustain themselves as 11 was the thought when their advocates were asking the City to please make it possible for them to maintain and keep that home as one of the original Beach cottages . Mrs . Henley, I think there was a mention that there is some money that spun off from the DeWitt Cottage, but didn ' t you say that you thought that money wasn ' t being used to sustain the DeWitt Cottage but going elsewhere? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: That money, the annuity, was when the property was acquired the agreement was that that amount of money would be paid as long as any of the DeWitt sisters was living. But now that the last of the sisters passed away, that annuity does not have to be paid. So, that just went away, and I think that accounts for a lot of the reduction in this budget . There was $89 , 000 that was being spent in Historic Preservation. Rather than even keeping a part of it to reinvest in Historic Preservation, it just went elsewhere in the budget, I suppose . It ' s really difficult, and the fact of the matter is Historic Properties are difficult to maintain, they ' re costly to maintain, and only so many Historic Houses Museums can be successful . That ' s why when I looked at this alternative plan and just saw acquire, acquire, acquire, I said, whoah, what are we going to do with all of these, because we know they don ' t create income enough to pay for themselves . I have said often, and I think our better way to do it is to encourage private ownership of Historic Properties and incentivise, I was just really surprised at the potential list of acquisitions we might have because then we 've got to operate them, and we see how costly that is . So, I don ' t know, but this is why I just think we need to have all these folks who are doing the job now together talk about their difficulties and their ideas , because I think just it ' s important that we hear from everybody. Unfortunately, when we just appoint a committee, we tend to leave out a lot of folks , and giving everybody an opportunity to come and have us have a listening session, I think we could learn a lot . I know I 've learned a lot just in the past few weeks in talking to people . But just where do we want this whole Historic effort to go? The Preservation Partnership is going to be having a session in mid-May or thereabouts , and they are publishing a book of the 50-most Historic Structures in the City, or something. Well , we had a hard time in working on that the time when I was working on it in narrowing it down to 50 . We could have easily had 100 . I think people don ' t appreciate how many Historic structures we ' ve got in the city. So many of them 12 are just hidden away, and where we are separated around the city they' re not all in one District, so people don ' t see them. But we have got a lot of really nice Historic structures, and most of them are private ownership and it ' s great that they are. Some of our oldest, the Weblin House and Adam Keeling, are privately owned, and I guess they' re two of the probably four oldest in the County -- City, and they ' re wonderful treasures . So, somehow or another, we ' re not getting the word out of just how much historic fabric we have in the city. We ' re not doing a very good job, and I just think we can do a lot better job . The more people we have involved, the better it ' s going to be . LYNN CLEMENTS : Mrs . Henley, the condition that was proposed, you were talking about having a Public Forum, that would be the model that exists already is sort of like the Arts and Humanities Commission where that is funded and then they provide grants to local organizations that perform in the city, where perhaps the same thing could happen . We know this isn ' t the budget year to do that, but in the future if we could get the funding going per capita, those organizations could apply to the Historic Preservation Commission for funding. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I think once we get the funding, then that ' s the time to establish the Commission, but right now they don ' t have any money to help distribute . So, I think we would be premature to appoint people until we really have kind of fleshed out this issue that we have with what we have out there . I know I 've got a lot to learn yet . And I know that there are a lot , I ' ve just met in the past couple of weeks an awful lot of folks who are very intensely involved that I didn ' t even know until then . So, I think we ' ll be shutting people out if we move too quickly, and I just think we 've got a lot to find out yet about even the seven properties that we do own and how they ' re operated and what we can do to help. I mean, it doesn ' t always take a lot of money, but I know if the folks over at Ferry just got their grass cut for them they would think they have really arrived. But when you 've got to cut your own grass and clean the toilets and provide refreshments and everything, it ' s a daunting task for volunteers . And when they ' re competing with others who get all of that done with tax money, it gets a little frustrating. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Wilson? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: I was going to ask another question, but a lot of what Barbara ' s talked 13 about I think is the reason that we haven ' t done anything for Historical Preservation and now we have an opportunity to do something, and that ' s why I think the Commission is so important for them. It ' s a very complicated issue that needs to be grappled with, and it takes a lot of time . That ' s why we have other boards, like Beaches and Waterways, to deal with a lot of the issues that they ' ve had to deal with, like the Lake Trant issue, because they can focus a lot more than we can because we have so many people pointing us all different ways . But I 'm happy that the group recommended the Preservation Commission because I think it ' s a good first step to solving a lot of problems . The reason I put my hand up was , speaking of ICTEA Grants , we know the Lynnhaven House had a $250 , 000 ICTEA Grant , and I just didn ' t know if any work has been done . That ' s a lot of money we ' d like to get our hands on. MARK REED: Just been waiting for the property to transfer, so we ' ll move that forward as soon as we get the ownership. We didn ' t feel we could really go in there and start installing -- COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Well, a lot of the work, though, that has to be done has to be done by the locality anyway to apply for our end of the grant; the grant has been, can ' t say it ' s been awarded, but it ' s been designated for us , and we ' d love to have that money. MARK REED: We ' re hoping by May 1 the transfer will have taken place or shortly thereafter . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Just don ' t want us to forget about it . MARK REED: And it ' s one of the main things on our list to do to move forward. Council has already accepted the grant, but we haven ' t moved it through the final routing process where the CIP account gets set up and we then bring people on board, the consultant services that are needed, in that case, the design, mostly, as opposed to architectural and engineering services . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Thanks . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: May I go back to this question of Pleasant Hall? I know that there ' s 14 been some negotiation. If it were acquired, which of these camps would it be in, the owned and operated or the operated by non-profit, and where ' s the money coming from? This alternative draft, I was anxious to see what an alternative draft with some dedicated funding sources would be for Historic Properties, but when I saw this I said no way would I support this . This is just not -- I just think that it ' s going to take more than ten or fifteen people appointed to come up with a Historic Plan for the City, because as long as you ' re leaving non-profits out there who 've got to continue to fundraise and fundraise and work and work and work, they ' re not going to be able to participate in this broad thing; that we ' re going to be further dividing this whole effort . And I think you heard that last week from those folks who say "yes, you would" , because if we have got to continue to do fundraising and we ' re going to be competing with a foundation called Historic Sites Foundation, it ' s going to be harder for us , and it will be . And I think if we ignore what they have said, we ' re not going to be doing anything to help this whole Historic effort . I think we need to stop and listen. MARK REED: I certainly can understand why you aren ' t too enamored by the alternative draft . The question that was put to our department was, " If there are any other houses that you think you would want to acquire over the course of the next long period of time, which are those? " We provided them with a list . So, really it wasn ' t a question of what is your plan for Historic Properties or Historic Preservation in the future; it was simply a question of answering what Historic Property we felt should be acquired over whatever period of time it is . I mean, it ' s a 30-year period there . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: And nowhere in anything that we have had in any of these budget proposals or the requested but not funded or anything does it mention the possibility of revolving fund, which the Preservation Partnership was founded on the basis of being able to establish a revolving fund to try to acquire easements on property where they have properties that are threatened; purchased, an easement put on it , and then resold. So, that concept seems to have just gone away, because there ' s not anything anywhere that talks about funding the revolving fund, which was a lot less costly than purchasing property and then maintaining it forever and operating it . I 'm just kind of disappointed in the way all this direction has taken, because I just hate to see the Historic community 15 continue to be fragmented. I think that ' s been a part of the problem. Everybody has to choose which part they ' re going to work on, and that ' s the part they work instead of being able to work together . I know there are a lot of committee people, a lot of really good people who put in hours and hours at all of the properties because they really enjoy what they' re doing, but those who see themselves continuing to be pushed aside are getting frustrated. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, let me ask the Council if they would like to schedule a listening like we have on other subjects where the folks can be heard at roundtable discussion and take notes and see if someone can come up with a resolution . I was looking at a tape about the movie they are showing at the Visitor ' s Center in Williamsburg, and they talked about ultimately Williamsburg was saved because Rockefeller came down from New York with his family and wrote a check and started preserving the homes and rebuilding by getting archeologists to go in and find the things . So, even they have from time to time, with the visitorship down, their revenues weren' t coming in as quickly or as strongly as they needed. So, maybe there is someone that we ' re not aware of who loves Virginia Beach and its history who might come to the table and have some ideas and be able to fund some with a foundation. I don ' t know what else to say at this point because I don ' t have the solution, and I ' ll be honest about that . LYNN CLEMENTS : Mayor, we were looking for the Commission to hopefully fit that role, as well , to listen to the community, to look at Historic Preservation. We don ' t have a governing board for the three houses that are owned and operated by the City. So, we at least need some sort of governing group for that for them. So, that ' s one reason why we need a foundation, just to provide a governing board for that . But the Commission would be the Historic Preservation kind of center for the community who would do the listening and hopefully bring everyone together and see what we can do with the strategic plan. There does need to be some planning that gets done . That could be a venue for that . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, what happens to the Preservation Partnership during all this time? I mean, we 've got a Historic Review Board, which the Council appoints, we ' ve got the Preservation Partnership, which the City is -- so, now we ' re going to develop another Commission. 16 I don ' t know why there ' s the push to appoint this Commission at this point, why we don ' t let it evolve from going out in the community and inviting people . Because if the Council is going to appoint this Commission, you know what? We ' re going to appoint the same old people that we know that have been in everything else, and I think it ' s important that we find other folks who are involved. And I know that the Preservation Partnership, I guess , with Glenda, Glenda is the one, Glenda Knowles is the one that has kept that together and has really pushed and has been committed for ten years to that, but she ' s moving to Williamsburg. So, I suppose that ' s going to be without a leadership, and I don ' t know who ' s going to want to step into something if there ' s something else, especially if nobody is even talking about a revolving fund any more . Does that just dissolve and go away? I 'm not sure if the Historical Society is interested in continuing as a partner . That will have to be up to the board, but they kind of look at the mission statement of this commission and say "hey, that ' s the mission statement of the Historical Society, so where are we going to be and what ' s left for us to do" ? I just don ' t think we have thought this thing through well enough. I think it ' s a great opportunity and it ' s wonderful we ' re having this in-depth discussion and all these people interested, but I hope we don ' t lose the opportunity together instead of spreading it apart more . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mr . Villanueva? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I think I 'm looking at this historically where we have thought about this tremendously. I mean, prior to the ' 06 Elections , this has been a three or four year odyssey of trying to get these houses together and to leverage our resources . I think that ' s what the strategy was . In each Biennial State Budget, you 've seen less and less money go towards Historic Homes . You ' re having the City to pick up more, and I know we tend to want to please everybody and try to do it all . I think, in this particular place, I think we ' re just trying to focus here on the recommendations of all these bodies and all these wonderful people who spent hours and hours carefully deliberating this thing. I want to share your passion for Historic Preservation. It ' s just, can we just try to figure out a compromise of some sort where we strategically focus and we partner with different bodies and try to figure out the best thing? I think that ' s what the Preservation Commission was trying to do was look at this and look at alternatives in light of the fact we have not enough money to do it all . 17 COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Part of Barbara ' s argument, Barbara Vaughan ' s , all these things had been done, but yet nothing had been done . Things have been sort of studied to death. I think that we 've now got an opportunity to put a group together, and I think some of the same old people have done some pretty yeoman ' s work. But it ' s a chance to pull people together, and I 'm certain we will be open to who would like to participate, but actually be able to move forward and get something done . We 've been talking about it and talking about it . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: For over three and a half years, I think. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And you know Lake Trant, what an awful complicated issue that was that this Council, we had to sit there and grapple with all of those issues . And we were able to hand that over to Beaches and Waterways, and they came up with some really good solutions and really to dig deep into Lake Trant . And I think this Commission could really wrap its arms around the preservation, work on how to do a revolving fund, work on how to . I mean, the Historic Review Board, they look at Planning Items . Their mission is really pretty focused on the Planning Items that are going to be coming our way, so that ' s kind of, you know, maybe at some point that could be joined with this . But I really see this Commission as having a different type of mission than the Historical Review Board, but I think this is a real opportunity for us to do something for Historical Preservation and move forward, and I really want to support the groups and their recommendations . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Mrs . Henley, followed by Mr . Uhrin? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: See, part of the problem is that that study committee was six people, and they didn ' t have any -- they didn ' t go out in the community. They didn ' t invite these other organizations . As a matter of fact, most of them didn ' t even know that this committee was meeting, and they didn ' t reach out to get input from the other groups . When they voted for their recommendations, it was a 4-2 vote . I don ' t know why there ' s the reluctance to have an open meeting . I mean -- COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: I believe, I think we have . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: No, we didn ' t . 18 COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Each Public Hearing on -- COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Just that one Public Comment last week, which was all we could seem to squeak out . When we talked this morning about the Green Ribbon Committee, it had numerous meetings . They were all open. They were all over the website . We ' ve never adopted those recommendations . We ' re gradually putting them in place . The same thing with the Blue Ribbon Task Force . Our CIP says we 've incorporated some of them in our budget this year, but we ' re still studying others . We didn ' t just adopt everything they said. I don ' t know, but I very much want to, and perhaps this will just have to be the way it is, the other organizations will just have to keep struggling and go their own way and just wait to see if something is going to happen. I hope not, because I just feel that some of them just may go under while we ' re waiting, and that ' s just not good. I don ' t know. We can have a listening session for the Animal Control Facility and we can have a listening session for other things, but we can ' t have a listening session for the Historic issues . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Here ' s my great strategy. I 'm all for a listening session, but it ' s going to come down to the same table here of Council setting the direction on Historic Preservation, and that ' s what staff has been working for and that ' s what these bodies of citizens have been asking us to do, is just get on the same table and get it going . Before this, there were three different entities, one against each other, and we finally said "hey, let ' s all hug and -- " COUNCIL LADY WILSON: You ' ve got seven. You get three . You left out the others, and that ' s what we ' ve got to pull them all together. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Let me ask Mr . Uhrin to speak, and then Mrs . McClanan? COUNCILMAN UHRIN: Thank you, Madam Mayor . I would hate to suggest that I in any way have full understanding of all the complicated issues here . I think you have to have a term much longer than mine to really understand the background on this . But from listening to the folks that have called me directly and spoken to me about it and listening to the comments even that we had last week, it seems that the real concern is that the private homes and entities are concerned that there will be a larger city entity 19 fundraising that is representing itself as collecting for all of the Historic Homes in the city and that that would put them in an adverse situation in terms of fundraising . And if that is truly the case, then maybe an easy fix to this would be instead of calling this Commission the Historic Society or whatever, the ultimate thing is that may lead someone to believe that it ' s fundraising for every Historic Home in the city, we just come up with a different name for it that really identifies what its current mission is, and I don ' t know what that name is, if it ' s the ABC Foundation or Commission or something like that . I 'm just kind of throwing that out there, because I think that that really encapsulates at least my understanding of what the dissension is . If that is the true meaning of it , then maybe something just as simple as renaming the Commission may kind allay some people ' s fears on that . I don ' t think that there ' s this big pot of money out there, a finite pot of money, and these three homes are going to really get an unfair advantage . I think that really what it does do is it allows them to put their resources together and act as one body, but I don ' t think that that inherently puts these other homes at a disadvantage . So, I just throw that out there and maybe that warrants some additional discussion. I think we have to do something . I think everybody is sitting around this table saying "we ' re tired of talking, we need to do something" , and here we have folks that have put together something and for us to stand it up if it doesn ' t put the other homes at a disadvantage -- COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: That ' s exactly what I said way back when that committee was first appointed, and I said it at the group twice . If you ' re going to have this foundation, at least name it so that it reflects that it ' s only collecting for the three sites so it ' s clear . It ' s a simple solution, as far as the Foundation goes , go ahead and call it the Francis Land Adam Thoroughgood Lynnhaven House Foundation, and you 've got it . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Or TOH . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Yes , you 've got it . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: Three Old Houses . COUNCILMAN UHRIN: Well, somebody has got to come up with a creative name for it . 20 COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, that ' s exactly the easiest thing . That ' s the Foundation piece . Now you have this other question of this Commission piece . Why don' t we deal with the Foundation piece first and then, I don ' t know, but that ' s the thing that I said the day the Committee was appointed; just don ' t call it the Historic Sites Foundation. MARK REED: There ' s no problem with that . We certainly can look into making sure there ' s a different name for it . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Let me let Mrs . McClanan speak. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: No, no . I , really, to tell you the truth, I really don ' t want to say, but I feel like I should because I think this is unfortunate that it ' s come to this point, because I think there are many, many, people in this city who support Historic Houses, support everything . And whatever marketing title and what ' s the most creative marketing, that ' s what John was saying, that we need something catchy and captive . But our staff has been advisory to this group, and my thought was that if we ' re at this point and we feel that whatever you all, when you go, if you want to form a group that will proceed to implement these recommendations and further recommendations , I don ' t see Historic Preservation in this city beginning and ending today or last week or this week or for any small group of houses . I learned back when I was working with the Francis Land House some board over in Portsmouth invited me to a ball that they have every year that the tickets are so hard to get that you have to stand in line, if you don ' t get your name in the pot . I mean, that ' s part of the fundraising of how they ' ve done over there . There ' s no reason in the world, there ' s plenty of work for everybody to do . I 've written enough checks and I 've tried to help all of them all I can, because I think they ' re great and I think they ' ve added a tremendous amount to the city. And instead of us worrying, I think the good that come out of this, if the name bothers several people we can change that, but we need to bring whoever needs to be brought in to talk about it . I think they ' re very capable of setting up that meeting and letting as many of us come as willing to come and talk about it . I don ' t see that these are, Mrs . Wilson, all this, I haven ' t heard that -- people just want us to do something and move on, like Ron said. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: We ' ve been talking about it for so 21 long. COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: It ' s been going on now my whole term in office this time . We ' ve been talking about this on and off . And I agree to some extent with what Mrs . Henley has said, you know, this is a topic that we don ' t want to leave anybody out . There ' s plenty of work, plenty of fundraising. There ' s enough for all of us to do . We can put everything in the world into it . So, I think if we want to ask the Committee to ask Glenda and Mark to go ahead and set something up and let everybody in the city who wants to come, if we need to rent the Convention Center, if there are that many people, but I thought the Public Hearing the other night was a good one . It brought some well-informed people, strongly opinionated, and there were other people who didn ' t speak who came down just to lend their support, and there are many more out there who will lend their support . And I think the proprietary thing about different houses, different ones of us have different associations and different backgrounds, we 've all been involved in this . We 've worked with different houses, but I haven ' t gone out to battle with any of the others that wanted to raise money. I 've been so happy to see them come into the fold, and a lot of them have . It ' s been so wonderful to see so many. And if we can get that many more in, and we ' re not going to be able to buy all of them that we can find, but I know members of this Committee researched a lot of places around the Country, talked to a lot of foundations, and went all over the State and all over the Country. There are many, many, different ways and we haven ' t heard the only way, and we haven ' t heard but there may be some new innovative way out there . I ' d like to see us keep moving. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, then why don ' t we decide on setting up a listening, and I think you all said maybe the name of the fundraising for the three original purchase homes could change its name? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: The name is not a big deal . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: We ' re not married to it . MAYOR OBERNDORF: That ' s what I 'm saying . COUNCIL LADY MCCLANAN: You ' re exactly right . MAYOR OBERNDORF: So, then we hold the listening, like we did with the doggie thing, and we 22 had some really good support . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Is this the "housie" thing? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Yes , the "housie" thing. And why don ' t we sit down, because what is happening, there has been simply the people from the Baptist Church in Kempsville came to Mr . Diezel and myself and said "our church can ' t afford to keep up" , it was the School of Music, and now it has its original historic name back, and that ' s why they were looking to be included. They' re part of the people that should be brought to the table to see if the church could do some of the support if there were other funds that were raised for the overall effort of preserving Historic Homes, as opposed to just the -- and keep the fundraising for the three originally purchased homes , but also try and find out what others want to do . I know when I picked up the paper this morning, my husband pointed out we lost a 100-year-old home down County yesterday. I think it burned down. There were shells that were going off and all sorts of exciting -- COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: It was just a good old hunter, some shotgun shells there . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Well, look at the grants and the revolving fund and look at all of that, and that ' s a lot of what the work that the Commission is supposed to do, but you ' ve got to let them get started. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I think a lot of folks would be really excited at the opportunity to come together and talk about all the ideas . It just seems to me that we could have a fundraising event every year that included everybody that had tickets that were hard to get if we had everybody working together, because I think it holds a great opportunity and I ' d be real excited to work on it . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, let me ask you this . How about if the organization you just mentioned, I don ' t want to call it an incorrect name, tell me what it ' s called? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Foundation? COUNCILMAN DYER: Your Honor can mention it . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: There ' s two words . 23 MAYOR OBERNDORF: What are we trying to work out so we can all listen? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: We want to just have a listening. The Foundation, and that ' s going to govern the three houses; they weren ' t the originally purchased ones . They are the ones that the City owns and operates, because we had purchased others before them that are boarded up and such that are not doing anything, that those three houses that the City operates need a governing body, and that ' s fine . I think the Foundation, they can raise money together with a name that makes it clear that they' re raising money for those three houses . Then we ' ll have this listening to be able to hear from everyone who ' s interested and then from there we can move to a Commission if that ' s deemed to be the right thing to do . I think that ' s the way to go . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: This will make you happy? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: That makes me delighted, and that ' s not so hard, is it? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: No . I 'm happy to move it forward. MAYOR OBERNDORF: You ' re going to take this responsibility? COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: No . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Before we leave, so we don ' t go through this dance again, let ' s see what we ' re agreeing to around this table . The Foundation that supports the City-owned properties that have been purchased by the City, if they would be so inclined to make their name more specific . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: They haven ' t been formed yet, so I 'm sure they wouldn ' t mind. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Then why don ' t we have the listening and also make the presentation to the people that come about the proposal for -- name the other Committee for me, I 'm sorry? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: The Commission. MAYOR OBERNDORF: The Commission. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Preservation Commission. 24 MAYOR OBERNDORF: Preservation Commission, let them explain that, and then have the dialogue around the table . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, that -- okay. MAYOR OBERNDORF: No, what am I doing wrong? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: I don ' t know. All right . There were two . See, that ' s I think part of the confusion. There were two recommendations . There was a recommendation for the Foundation, which would govern and raise funds for the three properties the City operates, and it ' s going to have a name that ' s going to reflect the three properties that the City operates, and then there was the other recommendation that we have the listening first before we appoint that . One of the things is, the people who talk can decide whether that ' s the right step or whether there ' s something else that we should do, and appointing the Commission may be one of their recommendations . So, this way we get the input from everybody. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: I ' d really like to just put it out there next week, I think it ' s supposed to be on our Agenda next week, and vote on it and move forward from that way. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: And if the Council doesn ' t want to support it, they can vote it up or vote it down . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: But we ' re not appointing people next week. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: No, no . COUNCILMAN VILLANUEVA: We ' re just voting for the Commission. COUNCIL LADY WILSON: Right, vote to form a foundation. But, I mean, I think to keep it moving forward, I think, really, I really would like to see it; is that what you want? MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. Mrs . Henley? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Can we set the date for this listening, please? It ' s going to be, well, I hope it doesn ' t come after we 've appointed the people 25 to this Commission. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, if the Commission is -- is it already appointed? COUNCIL LADY WILSON: No, no . We haven ' t even -- COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: We haven ' t even decided whether we ' re going to establish one . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: We were going to vote next week to establish the Foundation, establish the Commission. MAYOR OBERNDORF: I think everybody here is well intentioned. I don ' t think anyone wants to destroy anything good that has been done in the city, and it ' s sort of like swimming in quicksand because I 'm not sure what ' s going to -- do we have, I 'm trying to find out, I don ' t want to offend anybody in this, honestly, because we all agree that we would like to protect the beautiful homes and the DeWitt Cottage and the Lifesaving Station that we have invested in, and in addition save the homes that are still yet to be, as Mrs . Henley said, under private ownership with the different things made available, how can we get all of that; is it possible? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: If we let everybody come together and give us their ideas, that ' s the first step, as I see it . And that ' s what I 've been asking for all along, that we ask everybody to participate in helping us develop these ideas . I think we ' re shutting out a lot of people if we don ' t take that step first . COUNCILMAN UHRIN: So, I think she ' s asking for us to set up the meeting so that we can do that, and that ' s regardless of the action for the Commission or whatever . I mean, it could be done after . I mean, you could set up or establish that there will be a Commission, then have the meeting to talk about it, right? Then you set the people after that . But if I could make a request, if we can call it a Town Meeting or something like that instead of a listening? It makes it sound like a seance . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: This is the opportunity for us to learn about a lot of things, and I think it ' s important and I don ' t know why there ' s a push to establish a group of City-appointed, City-funded people to do 26 exactly what we 've got a non-profit that doesn ' t cost the City a penny to do . I don ' t know. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, let me just say from my personal background, we served, I served on the Library Board for ten years, which is a City Council Appointment, and City money funded it . I don ' t think you could have found any greater people that worked day and night and paid for their own gasoline and did all the things that we did for the Libraries . Dozier came to represent Pungo, and the doctor ' s wife from down there, Mrs . Hancock. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I think that ' s fine . MAYOR OBERNDORF: I mean that, I found that volunteers just get enthusiastic about doing a good job so that we all benefit . COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: That ' s right, but I think in doing that, I think that we will necessarily say to some of the existing groups that they aren ' t needed any more because we don ' t need duplication . I mean, I certainly can ' t see continuing the Preservation Partnership and having staff go to meetings and sit hours and hours with those . I certainly don ' t see -- I mean, they ' re just duplicating, and I think we ' ll be -- and that might be what we say we want to do . And, of course, an independent non-profit organization may just say "well, we ' ll just change our mission and we ' ll do something else" , but that ' s fine if we want the City to take it over . COUNCIL LADY WILSON: It ' s been a very long day and I think probably we ' re all kind of tired and maybe ready to enjoy our evening . I would like for it to be on the Agenda next week and then Council can decide . I think it ' s just unfair that these folks have worked so hard putting it together, and they' ve asked us to make the decision, and one way or the other I think we need to make a decision and move forward. MAYOR OBERNDORF: Okay. You all heard Mrs . Wilson ' s proposal that it be put on the Agenda for next Tuesday. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: And you ' re heard Mrs . Henley ' s proposal to have a Town Meeting or whatever, and I would like to have that scheduled, please. MAYOR OBERNDORF: And you ' d like to have that what? 27 COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Scheduled. COUNCILMAN UHRIN: Could we just wrap it up, Barbara, in our normal -- that that will just be the next topic? COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: Well, I don ' t know. You know, it may very well be that if the City is going to take over and do the directions, that there won ' t be people interested in the Town Meeting because they feel that they aren ' t a part of it or have to do their own thing. So, I don ' t know. It ' s almost mutually exclusive, and that will just be up to groups . I ' ll talk to folks this week. COUNCILMAN UHRIN: Call it something, but not a listening. MAYOR OBERNDORF: I won ' t use that word. COUNCIL LADY HENLEY: You know, it ' s just a shame that we think the City has got to be in charge of everything. I think that ' s what makes government so big is when we think that the City has to do it all, and we can ' t leave things up to non-profits and volunteers and hard workers because if we ' re not in charge it ' s not getting done . MAYOR OBERNDORF: Well, thank you all for expressing your feelings and your thoughts . And we will try and see if we can ' t move forward and include all of the folks who feel they' ve been without a voice and encourage them to come to a Town Meeting to let us know. And I think as Members of Council , if we choose to be there, which I think would be a very good idea, to hear what else there is that we may not be aware of, a lot of good things have come out of people working hard, whether it was saving the Coast Guard Station, and now, Mr . Uhrin, there are a lot of people who want you to save that brick Post Office across the street . (Whereupon, the discussion of this matter was concluded. ) 11 Mayor Oberndorf DECLARED the City Council meeting ADJOURNED at 5:48 P.M. j `vtiztilti/X manda Fin ey-Barnes,MMC Chief Deputy City Clerk 'u, Hodges raser,MMC 'ity Clerk April 15, 2008